Jordan Silvester – Real Estate Professional in Canada

On the Often Chaotic Fluctuation of the Real Estate Market: “And when it first started happening, it takes a bit to get used to the idea that the market might go up instead of 2% a year, it might go percent up 2% a week. That’s how insane the adjustment could be at certain times.

Real estate investing is one of the smartest moves you can make.  But like most investments, it is not entirely failsafe and it certainly involves some level of risk.

Jordan Silvester, a licensed Realtor and real estate investor, has lived through some good times and tumultuous times in real estate.

With the easy charm of someone who knows their place in the world, Jordan often reflects on the irony of how natural borders and human perception can differ. Just as the sunny allure of Florida stretches down farther south than parts of Mexico, the story of Jordan Silvester is one that defies conventional expectations, reminding all that sometimes, the places we hail from hold secrets and stories as unpredictable and captivating as the people who dwell within them.

For anyone involved or interested in the real estate market, this episode presents valuable insights into the dynamic nature of investing. Whether you’re in Canada, the US, or anywhere else, understanding these concepts can help navigate the waters of property investment.

Listen as Jordan explains the ins and outs of investing and taking steps to ensure that you protect yourself from taking too large of a risk, while still being able to play the game.

Enjoy!

Visit Jordan at Silvesters.ca

Authentic Business Adventures Podcast

Podcast Overview:

00:00 Navigating tough times, reaching out for guidance.
04:24 Financial downturn in retrospect; slower fall, fewer increases.
07:42 Advising clients on managing market fluctuations wisely.
09:48 Varied options for choosing mortgage lenders are available.
15:37 Loss of wealth due to decreasing investment value.
17:33 Unexpected risks led to tough family decisions.
21:26 Optimal exchange rate crucial for cross-border trade.
23:20 Strategic property cash flow and financing decisions.
27:43 Poker player considers risk and personal wealth.
31:03 Setting up unit for functional resale was challenging.
33:08 Learn humility, verify with others, avoid self-deception.
36:02 Adapting to economic changes through skill-building or hustling.
39:05 Considered vehicle lease options, chosen truck for benefits.
43:55 Resilience in face of past challenges, memories.
46:12 Property viewing essential for relational and investment.
49:58 Trust knowledgeable people, but trust your gut.
52:45 Business lessons learned from challenging personal situation.
55:52 Business program showcasing owner stories, sponsored content.

Podcast Transcription:

Jordan Silvester [00:00:00]:
In real estate, if you think about that, like how quickly can you close something, renovate something, and flip something if you set your closing 33 months out because of the time that was a good idea because 3 months later, it was worth 10% more just because you waited.

James [00:00:13]:
Yep. You have found Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumph and successes of business owners across the land. Downloadable audio episodes can be found in the podcast link found at drawincustomers.com. Today, we are welcoming slash preparing to learn from Jordan Sylvester, the real estate guru, I believe, of Windsor, Ontario. Is that correct, Jordan?

Jordan Silvester [00:00:36]:
That is correct, my friend.

James [00:00:38]:
That makes you, Canuck. Right?

Jordan Silvester [00:00:40]:
Yes. The good old, far north.

James [00:00:44]:
That’s, that’s that’s alright. It’s a good thing. We’re in or I’m in Wisconsin, which is, like, Canada junior.

Jordan Silvester [00:00:49]:
Actually, you’re further north than we are.

James [00:00:51]:
So, yeah, all the power there.

Jordan Silvester [00:00:53]:
You you’re you’re further north than I am. I I’m I’m south of Detroit. So

James [00:00:57]:
You know, I so my sister used to live in Toronto, And I remember looking at a map because I drove there a few times from Madison, Wisconsin. Yep. And I was looking at it thinking like, wait a second. We I believe I’m gonna blame my teachers for this even though it’s purely my fault. Like, you believe the United States is this rectangle, Canada’s the rectangle above it. And Mexico’s the triangle below that.

Jordan Silvester [00:01:21]:
Correct.

James [00:01:21]:
And that’s just how geography works.

Jordan Silvester [00:01:23]:
But then forget

James [00:01:25]:
that land and lines don’t follow that at all.

Jordan Silvester [00:01:28]:
No. We’re we’re kind of the other triangle in the bottom corner there. So you have Toronto come across and then down to where we are in Windsor here. You get a big triangle there that, really, we and, again, a lot of us, we’re south of a lot of the US. Right? So it’s really kind of funny in relationship to it. But like you said, like, again, then you got Florida that comes all the way down and goes lower than parts of Mexico. Right? So it’s all the same thing. It’s funny how we all think, though.

Jordan Silvester [00:01:51]:
So

James [00:01:52]:
But it would just be a lot easier for me if the people that conquered the land could draw straight lines that didn’t necessarily follow rivers.

Jordan Silvester [00:02:01]:
Yeah. Just go straight. Make it easy.

James [00:02:03]:
Just yeah. Right across.

Jordan Silvester [00:02:04]:
All the parallels. Oh,

James [00:02:06]:
well. Life goes on. So, Jordan, let’s talk real estate. You I believe you said you started in 2,008, which I hear was a great time to start a real estate business.

Jordan Silvester [00:02:15]:
Yeah. So the only benefit I had of starting my real estate business was that I was jumping into my father. So my father started in 88. I chose to get into his business in, May of 07 getting licensed by March of 08. So again, those going all the way back. I was a young guy at 18, moved out because of some of the stuff my father told me, and I thought I was smarter than him and then came back when I was 23 rulings. I wasn’t as smart as I thought I was and, came back to work with him. So, again, that maturity from adolescent, idiot to slightly less idiotic 20 something year old.

Jordan Silvester [00:02:47]:
Right? So you go in this, like, weird phase to kind of get, you know, go through all those tough times. I actually was in Toronto for most of that cutting my teeth, and that’s when I reached out to my dad because there was an opportunity in Toronto to, like, we’ll pay for your license, blah blah blah, join one of the brokerages there. And before I did that, I figured I should probably talk to my dad. It’d already, by then, been doing it for basically 20 years. And so I I rang him up and said, hey, thinking about it. So he drove in the middle, which is London, Ontario. It’s in the middle of both those. Had lunch.

Jordan Silvester [00:03:16]:
And 2 weeks later, I was moving back to Windsor to work with him as his assistant and get my license. So, you know and then jumped into the market at that time as we were dealing with the bank repossessions. We’re dealing with the with the downturn market, with everything in the US that had just happened. Everything in Canada just happened. That last recession before the most recent, adjustment in the last couple of years here. So it was a it was really an interesting time to jump in, and I’ll say this. It was good because I had to learn a lot about how to communicate with people. Right? You had you’re going people were underwater on homes, tough circumstances, tough conversations.

Jordan Silvester [00:03:47]:
So it really gave me, as a young man, the opportunity to get involved in a lot of things you don’t learn about until you’re much older. Right? Till till you’re in your thirties, forties, fifties, and and you’re dealing with these people in those real circumstances at a much younger age. So it’s a great opportunity to really grow a wealth of knowledge around humanity, not necessarily the business itself. And then, you know, over those years, helping people invest, grow their investments, you know, get into all of that, and then the sales of real estate and and the transactional portion of the business.

James [00:04:14]:
So tell me, 2008, when you got in that, was the writing on the wall for what was going on, or is that still kinda people looking around like, what’s going on? Is that thing?

Jordan Silvester [00:04:24]:
When I jumped in in o seven as I was working as my dad’s assistant, it was more of the downturn heading for the bottom. And we hit bottom around o nine, but it was a in in retrospect to what we just saw last year, it was a much slower fall in some respects. The difference, though, was is we didn’t see a lot of increase, though. So over the last few years, we’ve had the crazy increases, then we had a crazy fall. Before, you were more incremental. So it still put people in bad situations, but not not like you’re seeing today. And most of the issues that you saw then was, like, we had GM, which closed here. We had some other things with the automotive industry, which is what Windsor.

Jordan Silvester [00:04:57]:
Were basically Detroit’s, you know, little brother. We we we manage a lot of the automotive over here. So when all that stuff happened with the big three, we we were dealt a pretty heavy blow as a city because of that. And actually some lenders even left the city because of it. So you couldn’t get lending from certain B lenders. The primary lenders here, we we could still work with, but a lot of the B lenders, the guys that were wouldn’t wanna you know, it was basically like this place is done. The big three are gonna close. Like, because Chrysler was looking at, like they’re all looking at maybe going on.

Jordan Silvester [00:05:25]:
And if they did, the city of Windsor really relies heavily on Chrysler and Ford. And at the time, still GM, but GM was closing its plant, which was still known. But, yeah, it was a very, weird time, for for our specific area and specific situation, I would think, then than more of a global thing. This last one was more because it was an interest rate adjustment for US and Canada. We saw a much larger change overall.

James [00:05:49]:
Mhmm. Alright. Yeah. It’s interesting because I guess I relate Windsor with some of the towns that we have around us, not nearly as big as Detroit, but were they reliant on a big manufacturer? James common one.

Jordan Silvester [00:06:03]:
Right.

James [00:06:03]:
And when they closed up shop, those towns still haven’t recovered from that. Right. And it’s been what are we talking? 15 years, something like that.

Jordan Silvester [00:06:13]:
Yeah. We’re 15, yeah, 16 years down the road. So so, again, we saw a slow, we hit rock bottom here in in in Windsor and in most of Canada right around mid o nine. And then we climbed back. We’re back to pretty much call it normal. Best way to word maybe to describe it, which I didn’t know anything about because I’d never been in a normal market. I was told it was normal market by the other realtors, and that was by 2011, most of the, market had recovered to where it had fallen from. So you’d had your dip in your climb.

Jordan Silvester [00:06:42]:
And so that was only about a 3 year, call it, extravaganza of of stuff, and we only had about a 15% adjustment overall from the top to the bottom, back to the top. So Oh. In the next about 4 or 5 years but we only averaged an increase of about 2 and a half to to to 4% kind of at max year over year, up until about 2015 where then the whole game changed again. Right? And so in that scenario, the the market decided to go into Like, that was you know, everything was within, like, a 5% margin, you know, 5 5 grand over, 15 grand under. Like, there wasn’t a lot of stuff, maybe the occasional one that was less. But most of our market was highly stable. And then all of a sudden, stuff started going 20, 30, 40, 80, a 100, 200. It’s like, what on earth is going on here? And and it took me a minute to adjust because I’m analytical.

Jordan Silvester [00:07:42]:
So for me, I’m always looking at my client’s best interest going, I don’t know how the if the market stops rising at this speed, how on earth are you ever gonna have equity, or how are you gonna get out of this if the market were to just correct? And when it first started happening, it takes a bit to get used to the idea that the market might go up. Instead of 2% a year, it might go percent up 2% a week. Right? Like, that’s that’s how insane the adjustment could be at certain times. You could see a fluctuation of, like, you know, 6 to to $10,000 an average sale price in in from week to week. And it was just like, I don’t know. Like, how are you supposed to manage that with expectations? And then, you know, we always said to somebody, if you lose this one today, you’re probably gonna be paying at least 10 k for the next one because you’re not gonna wanna lose the next time. So just pay it today, you know, to get security, to get yourself into equity. Because at that time, that that just was the right advice.

Jordan Silvester [00:08:29]:
But it takes a long time before your brain to go from protect, protect, protect to, okay, I realize it seems like a bit of a risk and seems like a bit of a gamble, but this is actually the less risky option. Right? Like but to convince yourself, yes, pay pay even more than what maybe is going rate today because by the time you’ve blinked tomorrow and we see that next house, the rate will already have passed this one. Right? And so that was what kind of, I think, caused us to end up where we did last year where the market just came off a cliff. Right? And we literally fell off of a cliff here. We we lost about 30 35% of the market value in less than 6 months. So

James [00:09:02]:
So it’s interesting you say that because where I’m at around Madison, Wisconsin, we have not seen much of a drop.

Jordan Silvester [00:09:09]:
That’s amazing. And and that’s good for stability.

James [00:09:12]:
Me, it seems like, where are people getting all this free money from? Because that seems surreal. I was expecting the drop.

Jordan Silvester [00:09:19]:
Well, the I’m

James [00:09:20]:
just waiting for it.

Jordan Silvester [00:09:21]:
Yep. In Canada, we operate on 5 year fixed terms a lot of the time. So you we amortize over 25 years or 30 years like you guys do, but our rates don’t hold that long. So Oh. We have a renewal rate. We have things that cause our market to have some different fluctuations in the US market. Again, the benefit of our market is our banks are were are much more highly protected or or or securitized. Like, it our banks can’t really fail because they’re not owned really by humans.

Jordan Silvester [00:09:48]:
Like, you’re you’re you could go buy a bank in the provincial credit unions and things like that. Then you’ve got your your your private lenders that, of course, they’re in their own wild west. But any of our primary lenders, but they usually max out around a 5 year term at reasonable rates. Like, we were getting 5 year terms at 2 a half percent, 2%, 1.99% for a bit there. But, again, when now we have renewals coming and these people all got rates, let’s say, at 3, and today now we’re at 6, 5a half, 6%, well, that’s a big adjustment on your mortgage payment on, let’s say, you know, $300,000 mortgage and it goes up by by 2 and a half percent, you know, you’re gonna have to come up with another, you know, $75100 a year. Well, are you earning 5 years later another $75100 a year? Like, have you seen that increase in your income or or your other cost of living that we’ve seen go up over the last little bit?

James [00:10:41]:
Right. Especially something that you just wanna take that raise that you got and throw it at the house that you already have been living in.

Jordan Silvester [00:10:46]:
Exactly. Instead of So it seems to be to interest.

James [00:10:49]:
Yeah. So Interesting. So in Canada, there’s no 30 year fixed or anything like that?

Jordan Silvester [00:10:54]:
No. We do not. We we do 30 year amortization. No the longest fixed term I think you can get in Canada that I’ve seen is 10 years. The like, I wanna be careful. I operate in Ontario. But as far as I understand, most fixed terms that are done through any primary banking institution, maximum is 10. And usually, that rate is, like, 3% higher than what you would get currently for the 5 years.

Jordan Silvester [00:11:15]:
So why would you like, most of history would tell you just take the 5 year at this rate. Maybe in this moment because it would have been, like, 369 probably or just under 4 for 10 years back when the rate was 2%. But but you didn’t know, like, what were the odds that we were gonna go up as fast as we did, and nobody at least from everyone I spoke to, nobody saw it really coming. And at this speed, we all knew rates were gonna go up, but nobody realized they were gonna go up so fast.

James [00:11:38]:
Interest yeah. They did go up really fast.

Jordan Silvester [00:11:41]:
Yeah. Blink and you know, from from 0 to 55% in a matter of 6 months, 7 months or whatever it was. That’s that that was pretty pretty incredible to see the, our, our, our prime rate is at 7.2 and previously was at, 4, 2.45. So, you know, that’s that’s a pretty insane change in a matter of months. And again, if you’re on a variable rate mortgage, which we do have over here, you know, your mortgage payment, either adjusted, adjustable versus variable, it would make a difference. I’m on variable, which is good because at least now I’m paying interest only and not paying adjustable because then I I have time to make decisions about what I’m gonna do with my mortgage if and when it renews at these newer and higher interest rates. Right? So I had a 1 and a half percent interest rate variable for a little bit, and then now it’s at 6.2. So Alright.

Jordan Silvester [00:12:33]:
You know, live and learn. So the the on the life things, it was forever lock in, lock in, lock in. Hey. It’s been great for, you know, 5, 6, 7 years. Why wouldn’t you do this? And then now now I’ve learned why maybe on your primary asset, you don’t take the same risks you will on some of your investments. So

James [00:12:50]:
Right. Yeah. So does that mean that you’ve seen some people make transactions where they’re throwing crazy 30, 40, 80 k on top of asking, and then the value dropped because the market dropped a little bit?

Jordan Silvester [00:13:03]:
Yeah.

James [00:13:04]:
So upside down 150?

Jordan Silvester [00:13:07]:
Yeah. So we ended up, you’ve seen some people. So, actually, myself. So I bought quite a few just before the market shifted. I lost about 80 on a couple of them. Look, choosing to take the liquid loss at the time due to cash flow being almost impossible due to the borrowing rate being at 6 a half percent. It was like, you know, the w no versus the w don’t, and you’re sitting there going, well, okay. So I either keep all this leverage.

Jordan Silvester [00:13:30]:
Right? Because it’s not just the money that I’m gonna lose. It’s also all that extra leverage. If the market does continue to drop for any reason, you’re not getting yourself like, that that shovel gets harder, and you’re also carrying again, I was private lending. So 1% per month on half a $1,000,000 is is not cheap. You know? You’re looking you’re looking at $30 a year. So, you know, when you start to look at those numbers, it was just a matter of making some tough decisions. And people, the bent like I said, the benefit if you were on variables that a lot of them did go interest only for now. Right? So we have ability to maybe survive.

Jordan Silvester [00:13:59]:
And as they, as the, as the market adjusts, we might make it out. If not, the market is rising right now, again in Windsor. It’s not going up crazy. I would still call what we are doing is stable. We’ve been very stable probably for about a year, maybe 6, 6 to 8 months at least. We’ve seen a very stable market with minor minor variances down, minor variances up. But like I said, we basically within 6 months lost almost 30 35% of our market almost overnight. In in real estate, if you think about that, like, how quickly can you close something, renovate something, and flip something.

Jordan Silvester [00:14:30]:
If you set your closing 33 months out because of the time, that was a good idea because it 3 months later, it was worth 10% more just because you waited. Right? So those are some of the life lessons I had to learn, some really hard ones. I just call it my PhD in investing. Right? And so with that, I I, I won’t look back. People like, well, would you do things differently? It’s like, I, the only thing I’d remind myself is to have less hubris again, that 18 year old that I talked about earlier, you know, the 38 year old wasn’t that much brighter in some ways. He I believed I knew what I knew because I knew the business so well. I just didn’t understand the government very well. I didn’t understand interest rates very well in the sense of how they impact so much of life.

Jordan Silvester [00:15:08]:
Like, I knew that they impacted, like, my borrowing power and these things. I just didn’t consider it in every arena, from, you know, car payments to to groceries, to cost of living, to all of the other arenas that when they raise this rate, it’s gonna raise the cost of pretty much everything within our reach. And that’s the part where you’re like, okay. Well, I can take this loss. It’s not a big deal. Like, I run a business, you know, take an $80,000 loss. We retranslate that into money over here, and you do some things. But, like, all of a sudden, you’re standing there going, but my house isn’t worth what it was.

Jordan Silvester [00:15:37]:
My other investments aren’t worth what they were. It’s it’s this big change where all of the protection I thought I had disappeared almost as quickly as the money that I had invested disappeared to right? Like, all of the things I was like, oh, if I lose it like, because in your head, you’re like, okay. What assets do I have, or what backing do I have if something does go bad with this flip? Let’s say something goes wrong or we don’t make enough money or we lose money. Like, where can I tap if I needed to to make sure everything’s okay? Well, I always looked at my primary residence as an asset. I looked at my other investments as assets. The issue was was as this one crumbled, so did they. They lost their value just as quickly as this one lost its value. So all of the wealth per se that I was leaning on on one side disappeared just as quickly as the wealth I was trying to earn on the other.

Jordan Silvester [00:16:18]:
And in that moment, my brain was like, Okay. I’m gonna have to I gotta go talk to my wife because I go talk to my lenders and some of the people in my world and just humble myself and be like, I just made a mistake. Like, on it like, it just did like, I didn’t I meant to be able to make sure everything was okay, and I honestly thought that’s why when I give a personal guarantee, I honestly believe my personal wealth would have been able to deal with it. I just didn’t consider this simple truth, which makes a lot of sense. Now it’s easy to see in hindsight was that all of my wealth was generally in real estate equity. That’s where most of my wealth was sitting. So when the real estate equity disappeared, so did it in the investment because the the investment was also in real estate equity. So both things disappeared simultaneously.

Jordan Silvester [00:17:01]:
So the losses is over here. We’re repeated over here. And like I said, you’d think that as a real estate guy and as a and and as a as a as a person who looks analytically at things, you could put those 2 pieces together. I just always separated them. This pile, looking at my wealth position to do the leverage and do this pile, realizing that this loss level I could tap over here, just didn’t think this one would disappear too. And so in life, you know, hey. I I I’ll be 40 in July. So I I still I still got some time, rebuilding, re reinventing myself again, maintaining humility.

Jordan Silvester [00:17:33]:
Now this time, really trying to make sure if I’m gonna do something, do it at a scale that is acceptable risk. I didn’t realize what risks I wasn’t really willing to take. Like, I really didn’t wanna put my family where we kind of sit today. It doesn’t mean I can’t get out of it. It just means I definitely didn’t expect to ever have to be in that mindset where I was having to make some pretty tough or or difficult decisions around my future with with, with our family, with our home, with different things that I thought were highly secure and highly stable became very unstable very quickly. And not that my wife or my kids, like, they’re amazing. Like, they they understand, and I’ve been honest with them about, like, the reality, because I want my kids to learn, man. I’m, like, I’m not a 100%, like, you know what I mean? You do it as a like, my son is gonna be 18 in March.

Jordan Silvester [00:18:14]:
My daughter is 15. So you do it within the measure of with which to educate, not to create fear or to to, you know, be, oh, this guy you know? Because for 6 months, I I figured I was bankrupt. I figured the world was over.

James [00:18:27]:
There’s no way to do it.

Jordan Silvester [00:18:28]:
Well, you lose I I lost almost I lost so much money on the one side, and then you lose this over here and everything comes down at once. Again, you’re sitting there going, well, how do I get out of this? Because I’m I’m I’m using leverage. Right? Like, I did I did it with other people’s money, and then I can’t give everybody’s money back. There’s not enough to give it all back. And then you’re sitting there. I have my business and all that, but I kept biggest mistake I made. I didn’t keep enough back to actually put myself in a cash out position. I didn’t protect my wealth in this arena because I considered my wealth in that arena protected because it was equity.

Jordan Silvester [00:18:59]:
I didn’t consider the loss that could be created in my own, in my own assets. Right? That was those assets were assets, which meant I have wealth in them. I still do to an extent, but it’s like you gotta liquidate them, and then you’re liquidating an asset at its worst possible time to try to deal with it. Like, it’s just one of those things that I’m not. I I the benefit for now is I’m managing. I’m making it through. I’m gonna dig myself out. I I did, you know, turn a corner, went back to actually transactional real estate as my primary motor motor modus of business again, away from, call it the flip or the the cash flow pickup, long term plan.

Jordan Silvester [00:19:33]:
The reason being is is I need money today. I I don’t have the ability to wait 10 years for this thing to mature anymore. I need money from the transactional version of real estate to do my job to help people do whatever they’re doing. So the benefit I have is I have a lot of empathy now. A lot of people who are struggling, I at least can sit with them, and I and I and I, you know, I get it. Like, I I get these are hard decisions. You might have to, you know, do I have to sell the house and downsize? Like, maybe, yeah. You know what? So what? There’s, you know, it’s I’m not homeless.

Jordan Silvester [00:20:00]:
Right? Like Right. Yeah. There’s a lot of decisions you can make in life that if you don’t, but the sooner you make them, the the sooner you recognize them, the sooner you accept your failure and then realize it’s just learning, and then take that lesson and apply it to your life, you’re going to be a lot better off.

James [00:20:15]:
Yeah. Just lick your wounds, acknowledge, move on. Right? I mean, it’s all we’re all learning. So tell me, just so I understand here, when the US changes their interest rates and they recently were rocketing up, Is that the same as Canadian rates or can Canada just mirrors what we do? Like, how does that what is the relationship between US and Canada as far as interest rates go?

Jordan Silvester [00:20:38]:
So it all comes down to the the almighty dollar. So the fact we, as Canadians, like to, as as a Canadian, love for our dollar to be at par. So when I go to the the States, it doesn’t cost me a buck 35 every time I cross the border

James [00:20:48]:
to Right.

Jordan Silvester [00:20:49]:
To spend money over there. But the benefit for us is because we’re such a we’re basically 36,000,000 people a year, 300 60,000,000 people. So you’re basically 10 x us. So if we’re gonna sell something as a as a country, it’s really nice to have somebody across the border who has 10 times the people to sell it to. But the issue is a lot of our big suppliers this is my economic understanding, is basically they sell everything to you, and then you sell it back to us. So when the dollar, though, falls to if our dollar gets too strong, there’s no value for the Americans to then buy our stuff. So if our if our dollar gets too tight so then you consider inflation, you consider these interest rates. So it’s basically is you guys devalue your dollar or we do.

Jordan Silvester [00:21:26]:
Right? We wanna keep that balance somewhere between about a dollar 28 to a dollar 35. So that would mean that one one of your dollars will buy a dollar 28 Canadian to a dollar 35 Canadian worth of product over here. And that’s kinda that sweet spot for both countries to be kind of happy, because you have to think, if you’re doing a a a $10,000,000 deal and there’s a difference of, you know, 2¢ per on on that, that’s a pretty big change in in dollar value. So when when it gets too far to whack so it’s not exactly that, but, honestly, like, you’re you’re our our countries are very well linked, in their economics from that perspective. We we have the Bank of Canada. You guys, of course, have the Fed, who control your interest rates. And, realistically, we had ticked up our interest rate first. We saw a small adjustment in the market.

Jordan Silvester [00:22:10]:
You guys ticked your interest rate up 1%, and the world changed. And that happened in March. That was when the war started, just after Biden got in, and then the war started, in Ukraine. And then, also, that’s when the interest rates, rates, that that that peak hit. Me and one of my business partners, we went back to look at, okay, how are we gonna understand how this is really working? What is actually happening and why? And we tried to, like, what were the major, either political events? What were the major, different things to cause us? Because, again, the banks are responding to something. Right? Like, they don’t just like, oh, you know what? It seems like a good day. Let’s just raise the interest rate. Yeah.

James [00:22:46]:
Right? Whichever way the wind blows. Yeah.

Jordan Silvester [00:22:48]:
It’s they don’t, like, sit there, roll a dice, and figure it out. They’re watching something. And the question is is if you wanna really learn to win the game, how do how are they most likely to adjust? And this is where the Bank of Canada in in January of of of 2022 no. We’re in yeah. 2022, it said they’ll raise the rate to about 3 and a from from 2 a half percent to, basically, 3 a half percent. So 1% increase. So what did I do? I budgeted in all of my numbers to 3 a half percent. Why did I do that? Because it made sense to adjust my rates up to 3 a half, 4%.

Jordan Silvester [00:23:20]:
So all of my properties with cash flow, everything would work. So if I had to go into a hold position, went to the bank for primary financing, do those holds at 4%. But the issue was, was it end up at 6 a half, 7% instead of that 3 a half, 4%. Well, that, again, changes all those numbers drastically, putting me into, like I told you earlier, that major adjusted cash flow position. And so it’s like, which one’s worse? To liquidate, put myself into a bit of a financial problem, in a cash position or in a leverage position? I chose the cash position because then at least the debt I have the leverage back, because a lot of these lenders will still lend to me, which because I have great relationships. Again, to and I was honest with them saying, hey. We’re gonna work together to still get like, because I if you don’t lend to me, how am I supposed to be able to help if I’m trying to buy and do stuff? So they’ve all agreed to work with us because they understand it wasn’t like we went out there and flippantly lost all this money or did anything with a, like, I don’t know what the right word is, but, like, some malicious intent.

James [00:24:16]:
Like, it all to Vegas, threw it all in

Jordan Silvester [00:24:19]:
the road.

James [00:24:19]:
Just Red or black.

Jordan Silvester [00:24:20]:
Yeah. Yeah. So Alright.

James [00:24:22]:
Interesting. So were you in the the it sounds like you were in the investment james, flipping houses, and maybe getting into some rental property. Can you talk about that a little bit?

Jordan Silvester [00:24:32]:
In in 2019 so I I did the real estate thing basically to 2019. I still maintained as a realtor, and then I just started to buy some investments. I’d have been helping people invest for basically 10 years. And literally looking at a property going, why am I not investing? Why am I not like, I see all their wealth creation. Why wouldn’t I get involved? So I did, and I bought my first one, for $96, got a business partner to come in cash, able to do that deal, just actually sold it. It closes at the end of this month. It’s one of the assets I’m liquidating, but I was able to sell it for $250,000 today. So, again, that one, you know, will generate some good, cash out equity out deal with the circumstance.

Jordan Silvester [00:25:08]:
So that one, again, amazing. And then like I said earlier, I bought 3 I bought 7 in in basically 7 weeks. From February 27th to April 15th. I made 60 on 1, but I lost 80 on 3.

James [00:25:20]:
So right. Okay.

Jordan Silvester [00:25:22]:
So so again, and and the issue was was I was I I I’m part of a real estate team. I joined 1 specifically because I still wanted to make sure I could do my real estate job, help people do that portion, but I was also focused a lot more on my investment business and growing long term thing. The one mistake I made when I bought those 7 is I bought 3 or 4 of them as specific flips. I did not buy them with a negative strategy, really of hold. I figured if I had to, I could hold them, but they weren’t great holds. And then the market changed, and then they became really bad holds, and then you didn’t have much choice but to flip them out. And those, of course, are all 3 of those all lost all all 3 of them lost money. The ones that had cash flow capacity didn’t.

Jordan Silvester [00:25:59]:
Why? Because when I went to sell them, there was investors looking at them going, oh, they have the cash flow income to be able to survive, so they were able to pay a little bit more into those ones. But all the ones that were designed specifically as single family flips, those ones all we we lost our shirt on.

James [00:26:13]:
Okay. So that was the question. These were single family james?

Jordan Silvester [00:26:16]:
Yeah. I buy I do most of my tran in the single family portion, like single family duplex, triplex. Multiunit, I’m not opposed to. It’s just, again, we in Windsor, that’s not a huge portion of our market. And, again, finding the right, you need a you need more capital leverage a lot of times to do those deals because you’re gonna be 35% down instead of 20% down in in residential versus once you get to that commercial level. So there’s just different strategies, again, different capital positions, different partnerships, and things you need, and that just wasn’t where my, like, with all the bank repos, most of that was all in the single family realm. So when I dealt with all that, that’s where most of my investors live. So that’s kinda where I played.

Jordan Silvester [00:26:55]:
Right? It’s what I learned. It’s what I knew. Not that I was ever opposed to bigger deals. And now I know, like, all I look at is is multifamily. So 2 units, 3 units, 20 units is fine. It all comes down to long term cash flow and sustainability more than it does to the the moment of the quick the quick buck. The problem was every I get the shiny dollar got me. Right? It’s like, oh, if I buy these, I’ll be able to set myself up financially where now I won’t have to worry anymore.

Jordan Silvester [00:27:20]:
And then instead, it went the other way on me pretty fast. And so I’ve always I’ve always lived, like, I’ve learned to live within my means, but at the same time, I took those extra things, and then then I invested them into something and then all of it. Like, my most of my personal wealth disappeared in a moment, and it’s because, again, I didn’t think I was gambling until until I realized I probably was. And I am a gambler, but I need

James [00:27:41]:
to gambling a little bit.

Jordan Silvester [00:27:43]:
Right? Yeah. I I but the risk one of the things as a poker player, you kinda look at the hand and go, okay. What’s the other guy got? Right? What are the odds of what hands he could have? And so if I’m gonna push in and I kinda pushed all in because I couldn’t see that they were they were somehow holding 4 of a kind. They had the pocket pair, and I’m sitting there with the you know, I’m sitting there on the board with the straight or something, and they flip it over, and you’re just like, well, okay. You got me. And the difference, though, is is how much I’d I’d pushed in. Right? Like, I thought earlier like I said, I thought I was just pushing in with the money over here. I didn’t realize it was my personal wealth position that was also being pushed in because when the market fell, it dropped in both.

Jordan Silvester [00:28:19]:
That’s where that big crater showed up, and I didn’t know how to manage it because half a $1,000,000 of personal wealth in my primary residence disappeared. Right?

James [00:28:27]:
Yeah. You know, it’s interesting comparing the analogy of the poker james. Because poker game, you have money that’s a amount of money that’s on the table that’s shifting between everybody on the table. When you’re talking about a real estate market, you have an an, it’s not a finite dollar value. Right?

Jordan Silvester [00:28:44]:
Right.

James [00:28:44]:
It’s either growing or a lot of times shrinking. Yep. So there’s just a lot of people are losing. Or if you’re winning, I guess you’re buying low selling high kind of thing, but you’re you’re trying to time the market and being awfully lucky as opposed to a point. I

Jordan Silvester [00:28:59]:
so that that’s a really good term. It’s like, where’s the bottom? I said, I don’t know. Where’s the top? Well, we found it. Right? That’s the current market. But the thing you don’t wanna do is you never wanna be, like, you guys have the you you have the ability to push your your capital gains forward. We don’t. That’s another huge change between our markets is, now the benefit is I can take capital losses and use them just like you guys do, but my capital gains, I have to pay and then continue to move forward. I can’t avoid my capital gains into a bigger, better asset.

Jordan Silvester [00:29:27]:
Like, you guys can pushing that capital gain.

James [00:29:29]:
Oh, you’re talking about commercial stuff.

Jordan Silvester [00:29:31]:
The Yeah. The the the 10 80 I

James [00:29:32]:
wanna say 301. Yeah. Yeah.

Jordan Silvester [00:29:34]:
The it’s the exchange. But, yeah, you guys have an ability to to move it. We don’t have that. So, again, there are aspects of things that are up that that transact differently in our markets. But real estate, man, it’s it’s if it’s not a cash flow asset, and this is the one thing that’s now primary for me, if it will not cash flow at a reasonable rate with the easy thing, then I’m not interested in it anymore. And even as a flip, it’s not worth it because there’s no exit strategy. The most important thing is to make sure, like, if I had to just have leveraged the 3 or $4,000,000 at bank rates and I could have held, and even if it was breakeven or even if it was minus a few $1,000 a month, it would have been fine. Right? Like, it would have been something worth withstanding, but when you gotta leverage it and you’re underwater, like so it’s just definitely a weird, weird situation.

James [00:30:19]:
Tell me about the single families that were not, the single family houses, not families. The single family houses that were not a good hold where they just the houses were beat up, so you’re trying to buy them and sell them quick to make a buck kinda thing.

Jordan Silvester [00:30:32]:
They just weren’t designed

James [00:30:34]:
putting some work into them or how tell me about the bad hold part.

Jordan Silvester [00:30:38]:
Yeah. So the bad hold became where you couldn’t get multiple tenancy. So most of the properties we buy, we have the conversion for the basement into a secondary unit. So we build them in. And so a lot of times when you’re renovating to throw an extra kitchen in the basement, it’s only a few $1,000 So in a flip situation, you rough it in. So you may not put it in. You might just rough in a bar in the basement or whatever for somebody, but you rough it in with the intention. If you need to hold onto it, you just drop another 5 ks and then get your kitchen or 10 ks.

Jordan Silvester [00:31:03]:
Now you’ll have that unit set up. Cause you’ll put the secondary bath, you build the bedrooms in, you do all that layout stuff so that it is a functional unit, but it’s also functional for resale. The issue with these properties was was a some of them were just really expensive. So we bought things that were probably most of the stuff I bought up until that moment was under $400,000, and I bought 4 properties, and only one of them was profitable over $400. All of them were based on the leverage position at 1% on a lot more money, and their hold position became more complicated. The only one we could have done was the most expensive of them all, where we could have made it into 2 units, but we would have had to drop almost $20,000 into that one to get it there or liquidate with the loss. So it was like, what do you do? Because that investment into it, that 20,000 wasn’t gonna gonna add value to the area because most of that area is single family. So the average buyer in that neighborhood is not an investor.

Jordan Silvester [00:31:55]:
So a few things came up. So we were buying in neighborhoods that were not primarily investment neighborhoods. We were buying based on more or less a flip mentality with the theory that we could hold. But the issue was, like I said, on the ones that we could hold, the ones that were cash flow positive, the ones that did have, that did make it out. Why? Because the person who was buying it was also an investor and they could cash flow unit. Or if you were buying it as a personal residence, you could live on the main floor and rent out your basement. So all of these things added valuers on these other properties. It was just single family people trying to buy them single income.

Jordan Silvester [00:32:25]:
Right? Or dual income, however you wanna look at that. But, like, a a a single family income trying to buy this property. Well, they just don’t have the same wherewithal. So you you we lost more of that market more quickly.

James [00:32:34]:
Mhmm.

Jordan Silvester [00:32:35]:
So, again, we bought one for, I think, 628, put in money plus carry, and sold it for 625. Right? But when you close on them and all the fees and the real estate fees on the way up, even as a realtor, right, we still have to pay the buying agent and all those things. That’s where all of it wasn’t really in the loss of what we bought it for, what we sold it for. It’s in the middle of all of it, the the cost on renovations, the cost on time, the cost on leverage. And by the time you get out of that, you’re just like, oh, there goes 60 to 80 grand. Right?

James [00:33:01]:
So Well, education’s expensive. Right? Whether it’s at a school or hey. Of life course works. Yeah.

Jordan Silvester [00:33:08]:
Life life is full of excitement. I’ve learned a lot. I’m like I said, humility is is key, reminding myself what I don’t know. And even when I think I do know, verify with other smart people, talk to people in your world that have either the same experience as you or or more, and just say, Hey, what what are the things I’m not looking at? Because it’s easy, like, to talk to yourself whether that’s good self talk or bad self talk. Right? We’re really good liars to ourselves. It’s harder when we have somebody ask us real questions to be, you know, BS those answers with them and and say things in a way that, you know, are dishonest. It’s easy to be dishonest with us. Right? We want if we want something, it’s it’s easy to convince ourselves that this is a great idea.

Jordan Silvester [00:33:46]:
As soon as you ask a friend and say, hey. Do you think this is great? And they’re like, what’s wrong with you?

James [00:33:51]:
Yeah. Right. Pretty much wrong with you. Just phiologically. Right? Yeah. So interesting. I guess now that I’m thinking about this chatting with you, I’ve looked at the stock market over decades, and you can see there’s fluctuations, but recently, it’s been, like, crazy. Pump, pump, pump, pump, pump, up and down, up and down, up and down.

James [00:34:07]:
You’ve seen somewhere, like, in a day, it’s an 8 to 10% drop or or rise, which you’re like that’s unheard of a decade ago.

Jordan Silvester [00:34:16]:
Correct.

James [00:34:17]:
And it seems to be that interest rates are starting to follow that pattern with crazy high up. And then I’m wondering over the course of the next year, what’s gonna happen. Is it gonna go crazy high down? And then is it gonna be bouncing around like that? Yeah. So I’m talking Yeah.

Jordan Silvester [00:34:31]:
Go ahead.

James [00:34:31]:
Well, it’s interesting comparing our market here where interest rates have gone crazy high, but the value of properties, from what I’ve seen, has not dropped, anywhere near what I feel like it should. I feel like what should happen is what you guys have going on. Interest rates go crazy, property values go down because people have to make a monthly nut. That monthly nut has to be principal plus interest. So if interest goes up, that means principal has to go down or vice versa.

Jordan Silvester [00:35:00]:
It would only be on the new stuff. So I think the difference for us is is we were we have a lot of people on the variable, and a lot of people are advised in the last few years to be variable. And that’s where everything got hit really hard, really fast. Like I said, I work in a business where I can sell if my if my for for all intents and purposes, let’s say it went from $15,000 in interest to $62,000 a year in interest. I have the capacity in my business to go make that extra money. Most people don’t. Like, the average Canadian cannot just decide tomorrow I’m gonna go make another 40, $50,000 this year. It’s just, like, where are you gonna be able to

James [00:35:37]:
do that? The company. Right?

Jordan Silvester [00:35:39]:
Well, no. Right. Well, that’s sort of what I mean is is, like, you you you went to the bank. You have your normal job. You’re doing this. It’s not to say that real estate’s like, the benefit of my job is I have to sell more houses, which means I can go try to find more leads. I can go do things that generate more into my world that allow me to to go sell that 7 6 or 7 or 8 more homes I need to make that money. Whereas in most businesses, you’re trading time for money and you have a certain value of your time for your money.

Jordan Silvester [00:36:02]:
And so it either you have to raise a skill, you’ve got to start a side hustle, you’ve got to do something. But when you talk about $50 a year, what side hustle are you going to start from when 6 months ago, you were paying 15 to 6 months later, now it’s 62. Where are you gonna find a side hustle for $50,000 a year? Now not to say you can’t. I’m not it’s just in my business, it allows me that flexibility to be able to call it within my own sphere of influence, my own without having to gain a new skill other than just lead generate a heck of a lot better, I can kinda dig out. And so we saw a lot of people have to transact for that reason. And then the bigger problem was if you go to the bank right now to go get money, if you say, hey. I wanna buy that house. The biggest change was that 6 months ago, they had given you 6 $100,000 in a mortgage, and today they’re giving you $400,000 in a mortgage.

Jordan Silvester [00:36:45]:
So when you go to the bank and you’re putting a $100 down, like, instead of a 140 before so you let’s say you’re buying an 840 dollars,000 house. That house is now probably 640,000 mostly due to the fact that you can no longer leverage the same money from the bank. And so with it, that’s where most of the money disappeared. It’s no different than the car payment. If you go right now and you go to get a car from the dealership, you can go it doesn’t matter what the sticker price is to almost anyone because most people buy it on payments. Most people aren’t walking in with 60 or 80 or a 100 grand. It comes down to the interest rate. So if you walk in and you go to buy that car and it’s 0%, all of a sudden, the payment’s only, let’s say, $350.

Jordan Silvester [00:37:20]:
Right? And then 2 minutes later, you’re gonna go look at the exact another car, and that car is now you’re paying 400 and you’re paying $450, and it has a 5% interest rate. Yet that car is is less expensive than the like, the other car is is $60. The other car is only, is only $45. Somehow, for $45, you’re paying 4.50. And for 60, you’re paying because there’s no interest. And so people don’t always understand how much an interest rate affects borrowing. And people don’t and I I apologize to anyone, this is not meant to be, rude or anything, but the average people do not consider much beyond what it’s going to cost me. They don’t think about it in the bigger picture.

Jordan Silvester [00:37:55]:
I, myself, didn’t think about everything always in the bigger picture. You don’t look at it and say, well, how much is it really? It’s like, well, how much can I afford? Right? I want to live in this house. I can afford this house. I’m gonna pay for this house. They don’t really care. The price tag on the house matters a little bit. But realistically, if you go to the bank and they say they’ll give you the money, your brain goes, okay, I’ll buy it. Right? If the bank says no, well, you’re not buying it because you can’t afford it.

Jordan Silvester [00:38:18]:
And that’s, I think, the banks in Canada, when they tightened their belts really fast and the things adjusted really fast and all those adjustments came in, it came into that being the primary change, more so than it was people were saying, oh, I’m not willing to pay that. I can’t borrow that is the best way to describe how everything changed.

James [00:38:36]:
Okay. So it’s not that I can’t afford that. It’s that I can’t borrow that.

Jordan Silvester [00:38:40]:
I can’t borrow it. Yeah. For affordability, when you think about it, if I if I say to you, you can buy this thing for $50,000, you can buy the same thing for $40,000, The issue is you’d say, I’ll buy the thing for 40,000. Now, if I say you can buy the $40,000 one with a $600 payment, you can buy the $50,000 with a $500 payment. Now, which one are you buying? Well, now you’re buying the $500 payment and not and and and not the the the $10,000 less because the payment is lower. Yeah. And people’s brains probably

James [00:39:03]:
there, I guess, because I look at the big number.

Jordan Silvester [00:39:05]:
Well, a lot of people will to an extent, but when you go to get your preapproval at the bank, when you think things through and and and, again, I do sometimes, but not all the time. Like, I I looked at vehicles. But, like, when I went to I got a vehicle recently, another lease for the business, and I found that the benefit of buying getting this lease was the residual was so powerful in the truck compared to the car. 1 was 48%, 1 was 84%. So the the truck’s only, like, 8.60 a month, and the car was almost 10.60 a month. Yet the truck is 60,000. The car was only 48. So this is why when I say but and I got the truck because the residual is powerful, and it’s only at least for 2 years.

Jordan Silvester [00:39:39]:
So I’m not gonna have the benefit of the value of that asset in the long term likely anyway unless I choose to buy it. But my point is is, again, people don’t always consider that other side. And when all of a sudden the interest rate changes like we have in Canada, which is why I think there’s more movement here. If you bought your home and you locked in at 3% for 30 years, you’re never gonna you’re you’re never breaking that mortgage. You’re gonna sit there for a long time unless interest rates are somewhat lower. You have a life experience that gives you a reason to make that change. Whereas up here, we don’t we only have 5 years or 2 years or or whatever we’ve locked

James [00:40:09]:
locked in. Okay. Yeah. That’s what that’s what we have right now is a lot of people got the crazy low interest rates

Jordan Silvester [00:40:14]:
Yeah.

James [00:40:15]:
For their 15, 20, 30, or whatever.

Jordan Silvester [00:40:17]:
Yep.

James [00:40:17]:
So they’re just holding tight so the market doesn’t have a lot of property on the market to sell.

Jordan Silvester [00:40:23]:
Yes. The the I would I would say if you wanna look at the best stat that might tell show you a more clear reality is look at the number of sales in 2021, 2022, 2023, And look at the number of sales that happened, because that’s another thing we got killed on was we went from 7, 800 sales a month in Windsor Essex, where I live, down to about 250 last month. Right? So 350 was normal. Like, that’s December, so don’t you know? But 350. So we’re about we’re we’re somewhere between 45 60% of the sales. And at that rate, we’re also down. Like I said, our average sale price was 7.32, fell all the way to about 45. We’re back up around 525, 45.50 in that.

Jordan Silvester [00:41:03]:
Like, we’re flirting in that window. We’ve been right in that window basically the whole time after we hit the bottom and bounced. And so when you look at that so we lost not and as a realtor, everything is percentage based. So we lost the number of james, and we lost the amount of value of the sale itself as a as an overall. So you look at all of these metrics that come out. And that’s why I say when you’re not seeing your market fall, it’s because you guys, again, in some respects, are more stable because of the 30 year fixed

James [00:41:27]:
Mhmm.

Jordan Silvester [00:41:28]:
Versus our 5 year fixed because people have to make decisions sooner. Because if all of a sudden you’re underwater and you can see the the the the ship coming at the end of the thing going, how am I gonna get out this? You might make a decision sooner than later just to reevaluate your life and adjust yourself into a better long term position, or you took a 2 or 3 year because you got a 1.99 rate for 2 years. Well, 2 years later, it’s 6%. You’re like

James [00:41:50]:
Sure.

Jordan Silvester [00:41:50]:
Okay. How am I gonna pay that bill? So

James [00:41:53]:
Yeah. You know what’s interesting? Because our commercial real estate works like what you’re explaining for the Canadian real estate.

Jordan Silvester [00:41:58]:
Right.

James [00:41:59]:
Where you may be amortized 20, 30 years out, but it’s a 5 year balloon. So you’re essentially either paying it off really fast or having to refinance.

Jordan Silvester [00:42:07]:
Right.

James [00:42:07]:
And hoping that that interest rate is somewhere affordable at that 4 and a half, 5 year mark.

Jordan Silvester [00:42:13]:
Yeah. And so you’re banking on the future. And so, again, one of the things I would say is one of the things I’ve always taught people is I always say being being in equity is better than being in equity, but also if you don’t wanna live in it, buy a rental and live with your parents. Buy a rental and rent where you wanna live. And the reason I say this is and I and I don’t think if you’re a parent like, if my son tomorrow doesn’t he can only afford to buy a property in a neighborhood that I would prefer he doesn’t live in, but he can rent it out, and he can still live here at my house, cool. Build your wealth, kid. Because, a, if he doesn’t buy that, he’s not he’s still gonna live in my house anyway. Right? So might as well have him pick it up, get himself into an equity position long term.

Jordan Silvester [00:42:49]:
We all know long term equity plays will almost always win. It’s very rare if you hold on to something for 10 years. So if he buys it when he’s 20 years old, by the time he’s 30, it will a 100% have been a very good decision. It may not be a good decision in year 2, but it will definitely be like, again, in most of history, we can say, you know, people like, well, history might repeat itself. Look at all the volatility. It’s like, maybe not. Maybe we’re headed into some new, world thing. But we I just tend to believe that history, even when it does look odd, still has a repetitive nature to it.

Jordan Silvester [00:43:19]:
In time, it’s always balanced out. In time, everyone forgets. COVID? How much so we were in lockdowns. We were dealing with all this stuff. You guys are dealing with COVID and all that stuff. And, really, COVID is a is still in our in our vocabulary, but I’ll take this one, 911. 911 is 21 years ago. It’s real in my brain.

Jordan Silvester [00:43:36]:
It happened while I was in high school. I’ll never forget. But, like, once a year, I remember now. Like, once a year when it’s like, oh, it’s 911. You’re like, oh, yeah. And you and you remember the the suffering. You remember the pain of that day and and the change in the world.

James [00:43:49]:
But Yeah. We still get on airplanes. We still go on skyscrapers. We’re not Yep. Like, the world’s not ending.

Jordan Silvester [00:43:55]:
And and so we moved on, and the best way to say is that it becomes a memory instead of a, an experience. And so we no longer have the experience of that moment, but we do have the memory of it. Similarly, I would say that most of the reason why a lot of things that just happened, COVID this in this interest rate adjustment, all of these cost of living things, they’re all gonna wash themselves out because the population is resilient. It’s proven that in the great depression and proved it in world war 2. It proved it again, you know, through the through the eighties crash, the seventies crash, the nineties, like it’s proved it through and through again in different different areas. And, sure, there’s a a mine closes in this small town and the only thing for the town, and it’s never gonna come back. Well, that’s that like you said, there’s some places where you are where once the once the automotive industry, you know, walked away, you were in a spot where it didn’t come back. Like, that makes sense because there was something that drastically changed that permanently.

Jordan Silvester [00:44:45]:
But most of the time most of the time, life goes on. It finds a new way. There’s a way through. It just is different than what everyone expected, and most people can’t see what it’s gonna be. And I’ve learned I have a plan in my head. I expect the plan to not work like it does. As long as I stay intentional to actions, something positive is coming.

James [00:45:03]:
Right. So Plus you’re talking about houses where people have to live. No one’s gonna well, I I would’ve say, yes. Not many people get choose to just live in a cardboard box under a bridge.

Jordan Silvester [00:45:12]:
Right.

James [00:45:12]:
They’ll be looking for a house or apartment or somewhere to live. So they’re going to need that. We’re here. This is where it is. Exactly. So, yeah, you’re investing in a in a necessity Yep. Rather than, I don’t know, investing in

Jordan Silvester [00:45:26]:
candles or

James [00:45:27]:
something like

Jordan Silvester [00:45:27]:
that. Shelter’s always necessary. Again, people that that they always were saying AI might take over real estate. I sort of laughed. They said, because people buy things with sight unseen. I said, now we have virtual walkthroughs. We have photos, but you know how many people are gonna buy their home without seeing it? Investors? Sure. Investors don’t care.

Jordan Silvester [00:45:44]:
Investors are like, I don’t have to live there. Long as I like, the inspection goes well, like, doesn’t really matter. I can paint walls. I can change floors. But if you’re gonna actually live in that house, you wanna walk up the driveway. You wanna walk through that front door. It is not the same thing for the average person to buy something they’re going to put their family in without walking in it. And that’s why I think in real estate is a funny thing because AI and all the technology and all these amazing things, they’re still gonna need to be realtors in some way, shape, or form, even if all we are are are concierge door openers.

Jordan Silvester [00:46:12]:
Right? Like no. But, like, there’s some form where people are gonna wanna still get into that property to get a feel for that house because it’s we, we’re we’re relational creatures. We’re not we’re not static creatures. Even myself, who is highly analytical and and, a a bones based, self who is highly analytical and and a bay a a bones based human, which means I look at property. I’m just looking at the structure. I can change everything inside. And so when you look at that through that lens, even someone like me, though, if I’m gonna go put my family in it, I need to go walk through it. And and and even as an investor, I can buy investment set on scene.

Jordan Silvester [00:46:43]:
If one of my buddies calls, says we got a great investment, I ask them a few questions. Go ahead. Let’s throw an offer at it. I don’t need to go through it myself. I trust their opinion because I’m not gonna live there. So interesting of the psychology of human beings. I think we forget sometimes how human beings are. We are psychological creatures.

Jordan Silvester [00:46:58]:
We don’t always make the most rational choices. We make emotional choices. And a lot of times we use our gut. That’s that gut instinct to know a house is either good for us or not, more than other types of industries where whether or not these underwear from Walmart are good, or they’re from Costco or from, you know, wherever, like nobody, like whatever, but big life decisions, most people wanna have a bigger hand and and have that emotional attachment to it.

James [00:47:22]:
Fair. Totally fair. Tell me about the the breaking traditional norms portion of your operation.

Jordan Silvester [00:47:29]:
Yeah. So you’ll meet me all the time. This is the the live lucky hat as you brought that up earlier. I’m in shorts and a t shirt, sandals a lot of the time. Right now, I’ve got pants on. It’s winter up here. Right? So I’m wearing Yeah.

James [00:47:38]:
I was gonna say, isn’t it like freezing cold, man?

Jordan Silvester [00:47:41]:
Yeah. But, like, I honestly am a bit of a like, the authentic part of who I am is I wear I wear my sandals till it snow. So the day that there’s snow on the ground is the day my sandals come off, and they go back on as soon as I can. And then I like, the way that my dress changes because we’re we’re north. I’ll put the sweater on. I keep the T shirt on all year round, the hat on pretty much all year round. I am who I am, who you’ll meet here today. I’m if you come up here, you meet me somewhere else, odds are I’ll look like this unless there’s some dress code requirement.

Jordan Silvester [00:48:07]:
But for me, it’s just about being me. And if if I’m not enough for you, that’s okay. I get it. You might want the guy’s suit and tie, and that’s cool. Like, I I understand everyone’s got their person. I’ve learned that if I try to be something for you that I’m not. Now if I it’s a respect thing and you ask me to be respectful, that’s a whole different ball james. I’m more than happy to be respectful.

Jordan Silvester [00:48:26]:
I’m more than happy to, you know, meet you where you’re at, you know, with COVID and masks and life and things. But for me, I’ve just learned that when I’m in my element, which means I’m comfortable, then I’m the best version of myself for you. And as a realtor and my job is to help you, then I like, you don’t want me thinking about all these you want me to work for you. Use my brain. Use the intelligence. Again, as some people will say, well, you might be missing out on business because this is who you are. I said, that’s okay. Because I’ve learned one thing, probably in all honesty, if, if, if you don’t like who I am from the way I look, odds are, we’re probably not a person that would get along with me because I am gonna be who I am.

Jordan Silvester [00:49:02]:
I try my best to be accommodating, but I I I’m just gonna be me. And and so authenticity in business is is that my websites, my my online presence, the guy you meet at the door, You meet me at the bar. After hours, you meet me at the house to chat about a property. You meet me as an investor. You meet me at a conference. I’m just me, and I’m not gonna change just because of, let’s say, a person sitting opposite me. If they’re you know, the president of the United States wouldn’t recognize me, but, if I were to meet him, like, I would just meet him as me. I’m not gonna pretend to be something I’m not for other people anymore.

Jordan Silvester [00:49:35]:
And I did for a long time. You you wanted to pretend you need to be more. I am who I am, and I know what I know, and I know what I don’t. And that’s okay. Knowing what you don’t is actually way more important than likely what you do. Because if you know what you don’t, then you know the right people a lot of the time to lean on who do know the things you don’t. Like, I’m I know my like, you talk real estate and you start to talk in certain spheres. I go, that’s not my that’s not my sweet spot, man.

Jordan Silvester [00:49:58]:
But I got some really cool people that if I were gonna buy that, these are the people I’d be talking to. These are the people I would want. Like, I can help you, but these are this is how I help you. I help you by giving you a person I know and trust who will take really good care of you, who knows the ins and out of that industry, the ins and out of that investment, the ins and out of these things, whether that’s from lenders to investors to all of these other things in life, accountants and lawyers, like, man, lean on the intelligent people you have in your world. And the more humble I get around the things that I even do know, the better my life gets. I just trust I trust the information from others, and I still get to make my own decisions. So that’s a from a business perspective, the the mistakes I usually make are where I I give credence where I shouldn’t to others, where I don’t just trust my gut. And and in that, that means I had to have some tough conversations with some of my business partners because as things went the way they did, I had some different opinions earlier, but I gave credence to them.

Jordan Silvester [00:50:50]:
And I said and moving forward, we’ve had conversations where I don’t really play well as a secondary person. That’s it’s not to say that I’m better than you. It’s that I need for me to operate at my best, the ability to make the best decision I believe in the moment. But that’s not without it’s not just that dictatorship. It’s I’m gonna listen, and then I’m gonna make a decision. I’m gonna make sure I get all the information I can in the moment and make the best decision in that moment, but I can’t have somebody else who disagrees with me having the same level of authority. Doesn’t mean they can’t have an opinion. Like, I I don’t do well in in a 100 like, 5050 business doesn’t work in my world.

Jordan Silvester [00:51:23]:
I Sure. Me and my wife agreed to it’s not a 5050 marriage. It’s it’s a it’s definitely not one where I just get to tell my wife what to do, and it’s a but I’m the one responsible. So no matter if I agree with my wife and do what she’s agreed to do, I take responsibility for that if it goes wrong and vice versa. If I do say, hey, babe. I’m not gonna listen to you here. We’re gonna do this instead. I’m responsible.

Jordan Silvester [00:51:43]:
Right? And so the the issue always is is where does the responsibility lie? For me as a person in my authentic businesses, I will I will let you make decisions. And but just so you know, if I’m allowing you to make that choice, that means that I’m still gonna own the result because you’re in my business. You’re in my world. And what I’m not good at, if if I’m in a 5050, I’m okay if you’re my friend, and we’re in a and we’re in the reverse. You’re the one making decisions. I sit in the other spot. I can do that. I just need to know that.

Jordan Silvester [00:52:10]:
Then I can just let go of the responsibility. I’ll just be an adviser. I’ll come alongside you. But understand that you get to make the decisions because that’s the agreement on paper. I just can’t do the 5050 because the 5050 I find in a relationship is too difficult if not if somebody’s not in the authority, which means that it’s not an authority in this I’m wielding my like, we it’s such a weird thing in the culture, but it’s not this wielding thing. It’s this it’s this ownership of responsibility is the best way to describe that. And so I’m gonna own the responsibility. If I make the wrong decision, you’re allowed to to to deal with that with me because I made the choice.

Jordan Silvester [00:52:45]:
And so in my business, I’ve learned to put those things in place much better after this most recent thing. And I was and and, again, the person I had that conversation with was one of my best friends since I was 14 years old. It just because I trust him, and we were and and I wanted it to be that way. But in the end, like, I wasn’t I was not happy, and he wasn’t happy, and no nobody was happy because we ended up in a weird relationship. So this is not to say I’m right. He’s wrong. Who knows? If I had made my decisions and I had done the things I had done, who knows if we’d be in a better spot? Maybe the market had caught and james, and we woulda lost a $1,000,000 in upside. Like, in hindsight, sure, I look right.

Jordan Silvester [00:53:20]:
But at the time, I didn’t know. I’ll say that, honestly. Like, I didn’t know. But I just know for me in the future, I can’t be in that spot because I lost myself in that moment being like, I don’t know how I’m supposed to do this. How am I supposed to because my nature is to take on that, like, to become more of the dictator, to become that control authoritarian when I’m out of my my natural authenticity, and I do not like that version of myself.

James [00:53:43]:
Sure. Fair. Totally fair. I get yeah. Biz business partnerships can be a challenging thing.

Jordan Silvester [00:53:49]:
Yeah. But as long as everyone knows the rules of the partnership, it’s not different than the rules in your marriage or the rules in your in relationships with friends and and things. It’s everyone plays by the same rules. Like, if you have a buddy and he he breaks your you know, he makes fun of you all the time and he’s being whatever, and you know that that’s just a relationship and but everyone’s okay with the fact he’s gonna have a nickname for you you hate, that’s cool because you choose to be in that relationship on those terms. Sure. But if you don’t like it and you say, hey, man. If you keep that up, you know, I don’t wanna hang out anymore. And he chooses to keep doing it, well, then, okay.

Jordan Silvester [00:54:17]:
Cool, man. Don’t need to hang out anymore. Right? Like, we’re allowed to set our expectations in our relationships. And, again, as guys, you know, we’re always harassing each other. I always say if I if I’m being nice to you, you should be concerned whether or not I give a crap about you anymore. Because because it’s just fun to have fun. And and I mean it in the honest like, if I was ever rude or or mean to you, that that’s not the intention of my heart. My intention is to be a bit of a disturber of the peace and to cause a bit of smiles and a little bit of, like, type of response.

Jordan Silvester [00:54:47]:
But I’m not looking for anger. I’m not looking for for harm or hurt or or or to make you feel like you’re not worth something. Realistically, I’m trying to get you energized. I’m trying to breathe some life into you. And if it means I gotta make funny a little bit, it just makes me smile.

James [00:55:00]:
Right. I get it. I get it. So Well, Jordan, where can people find you?

Jordan Silvester [00:55:05]:
You can go to JordanSilvester.com. You can reach out at 5199-600-350. You know, we are always happy to chat from anything in life, man, whether that’s where you’re at in in what you need in real estate. That’s that’s my business. But at the same time, if you’re going you you have you have something you wanna throw by me financially. You want, you know, life, man, life is in relationships. I love being in relationship with human beings. So it doesn’t always have to be business oriented.

Jordan Silvester [00:55:32]:
If you think you can add something to my world or you got a story, I would love to hear it because I I I just love to learn from other people’s experiences. So

James [00:55:40]:
That’s awesome. And just to remind people, Sylvester is s I l. Is that correct?

Jordan Silvester [00:55:44]:
Correct.

James [00:55:45]:
S I l. Alright. Awesome. Well, Jordan, thank you so much for being on the show.

Jordan Silvester [00:55:50]:
Thank you for having me, my friend.

James [00:55:52]:
This has been Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumphant successes of business owners across the land. We are locally underwritten by the Bank of Sun Prairie. If you’re listening or watching this on the web, if you could do us a huge favor to keep the algorithm happy, give us a big old thumbs up, subscribe, and, of course, share it with your friends, especially those that may be interested in getting into the real estate game, whether that’s as an investor, real estate agent, or just for fun comparing Canada and USA. Right? That’s fun. My name is James Kademan, and Authentic Business Adventures is brought to you by Callsoncall.com, offering call answering and receptionist services for service businesses across the country on the web at callsoncall.com. And of course, the bold business book, a book for the entrepreneur in all of us, available wherever fine books are sold. We’d like to thank you, our wonderful listeners, as well as our guest, Jordan Sylvester. Jordan, can you tell us the website one more time?

Jordan Silvester [00:56:47]:
It’s jordan sylvester.com. So

James [00:56:49]:
Oh, that’s easy enough. Right? Past episodes can be fun. Morning, noon, and night. Podcast link fun at drawincustomers.com. Thank you for watching. We’ll see you next week. I want you to stay awesome. And if you do nothing else, enjoy your business.

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