Podcast: Play in new window | Download (Duration: 59:53 — 63.8MB)
Subscribe: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | Amazon Music | iHeartRadio | Email | RSS | More
Talmar Anderson – Boss Actions
[00:00:06]
You have found Authentic Business Adventures. The business program that brings the struggles, stories,
[00:00:25]
and triumphant successes of business owners across the land. Past episodes of course can be found at the podcast link at drawincustomer.com
[00:00:27]
We are locally underwritten by the Bank of Sun Prairie. My name is James Kademan and today we’re welcoming/preparing
[00:00:29]
to learn from Talmar Anderson,
the founder and CEO of Boss Actions.
[00:00:35]
Helmer, how are you doing today?
[00:00:37]
I am doing great.
[00:00:39]
I have a little voice thing.
I apologize.
[00:00:41]
We were at a conference for four days,
but I’m excited to be.
[00:00:44]
I sound way sexier and deeper
than I normally do.
[00:00:47]
So it’s really not a bad thing.
[00:00:49]
Now you got the Stevie Nicks
thing going on.
[00:00:53]
That’s awesome.
[00:00:54]
So I was interested when I think
Susie Moon introduced me to you.
[00:00:59]
Yes, she is the bee’s knees I love her.
Yeah.
[00:01:02]
And I checked out your website.
I saw what you have going on.
[00:01:04]
I’m like, oh, my goodness.
[00:01:05]
There is not an entrepreneur out there
that does not have employee issues.
[00:01:11]
If you don’t have employee issues
[00:01:12]
that just tells me they
don’t have employees.
[00:01:15]
Probably.
[00:01:17]
That’s a statement I probably should make.
[00:01:19]
But you are correct.
[00:01:21]
So how about we start off, what is
Boss Actions and what do you do?
[00:01:26]
I love that.
First of all, James, thanks for having me.
[00:01:29]
I really appreciate it. Literally,
[00:01:31]
I’m just trying to let people know
[00:01:33]
that they don’t have to figure
this stuff out by themselves.
[00:01:35]
So it’s always any time I can get people
answers faster than I’m in my lane.
[00:01:40]
And I appreciate that.
Fair.
[00:01:41]
The Boss Actions, hiring strategy and boss
[00:01:45]
best practices for business owners
and entrepreneurs because it’s a process.
[00:01:51]
It’s a system.
[00:01:52]
It’s not magic to find good people.
[00:01:55]
You don’t have to be
lucky to be a great boss.
[00:01:58]
And so I’m trying to make it as easy as
possible for people to quickly
[00:02:04]
find the answers they need and start
building their kick ass team.
[00:02:08]
Right?
[00:02:08]
It’s got to be specific to you, your
industry and what your business needs.
[00:02:13]
Nice. How long has
Boss Actions been going on?
[00:02:16]
So in 2018, Boss Actions was
the big shift, if you will.
[00:02:22]
I had an operational
consulting company since 2011.
[00:02:26]
It’s called Talmar It Up because
I’m all about action verbs.
[00:02:31]
Then we shifted to Boss Actions when we
[00:02:33]
identified that literally,
no one is out there helping people learn
[00:02:37]
how to hire the right people and help
them be successful in the company.
[00:02:41]
It’s interesting.
[00:02:43]
I had
[00:02:45]
Calls on Call,
[00:02:46]
my main business has grown quite
a bit in the past few months.
[00:02:50]
That’s exciting.
Yeah, it’s very exciting.
[00:02:52]
But that just means you’re hiring more.
[00:02:54]
And in hiring more,
[00:02:57]
sometimes you drop the ball
on the people that you hire.
[00:03:00]
You don’t know how good they
are until after you hire them.
[00:03:02]
Okay.
Those are two different things.
[00:03:04]
The boss dropping the ball and not knowing
[00:03:06]
if they’re the right
person before you hire.
[00:03:08]
Well, I guess in the end, I as the boss,
[00:03:12]
take responsibility for an employee
that I hired messing up.
[00:03:17]
I get it.
[00:03:18]
So
[00:03:20]
you have to tell me if that’s correct
or not, but I believe it’s at the top.
[00:03:24]
You look at the top.
[00:03:26]
Well, okay, James.
[00:03:27]
So I have, like,
100 questions I want to ask you about
[00:03:30]
that particular hire,
but let’s go high level first.
[00:03:32]
Sure.
So, yes, I fundamentally believe that it
[00:03:36]
is up to the boss to learn how
to identify what the business needs.
[00:03:42]
So, yeah, it’s on the boss.
[00:03:45]
But don’t take it so
hard on yourself because
[00:03:50]
I’m not exaggerating when I say,
[00:03:51]
as far as I know, I’m the only business
with a process that is really
[00:03:56]
giving people the ideas
of how to step through it.
[00:03:58]
So you just didn’t know that there was
[00:04:00]
somebody or away,
whether it’s my way and you magically find
[00:04:03]
somewhere else, but that there’s
a way to learn how to do this.
[00:04:06]
You can develop your own skills.
[00:04:08]
You can understand
there’s a process to it.
[00:04:10]
So I would tell you
to give yourself a break.
[00:04:13]
However, now that you know
the answer, shame on you.
[00:04:16]
If you do this for the next three years
[00:04:17]
and you end up in what we call a hiring
loop, you’re slowing your growth,
[00:04:21]
and you’re not going to serve as
many clients as you want to impact.
[00:04:24]
Guaranteed if you can’t get
this piece into your tool belt.
[00:04:28]
Yeah.
It’s interesting when you think about
[00:04:30]
the opportunity cost of a bad
hireful and honestly.
[00:04:36]
The stress and the energy.
[00:04:38]
So what happens to a lot of small
business is they try to hire, right?
[00:04:42]
They do the best they can what they know
[00:04:44]
to do what they think
they’re supposed to do.
[00:04:46]
And they just keep getting these people
that take advantage of them or literally
[00:04:50]
steal from them or don’t
show up and can’t deliver.
[00:04:54]
And they’re like, is this good?
[00:04:56]
I literally had somebody hire me
at our highest level package.
[00:04:59]
First question he asked me was, tell me,
[00:05:02]
you just have to tell me,
are my standards too high?
[00:05:05]
Am I expecting too much from these people?
[00:05:08]
And that’s what I’m doing wrong.
[00:05:09]
And my heart totally broke again.
[00:05:11]
And I was like, no, man,
it doesn’t have to be this.
[00:05:15]
It’s just that you want to learn how
[00:05:17]
to set the expectation so that you can
make sure you’re getting what you need
[00:05:22]
and matching it to what
the business needs for success.
[00:05:26]
And then we have to learn how to attract
and how to make people prove to us that we
[00:05:31]
have a reasonable expectation, they will
be able to bring those success markers.
[00:05:36]
And we do that with a lot
of different steps.
[00:05:38]
All right.
Does that help?
[00:05:39]
So tell me how when you first started boss
[00:05:41]
actions, did you have a system
in place with before no clean slate.
[00:05:48]
Let’s figure this out.
[00:05:49]
Yeah.
[00:05:51]
Before I was on my own
business owner, entrepreneur.
[00:05:55]
I make the joke, but I used
to boss around attorneys.
[00:05:58]
I ran law firms.
[00:06:00]
And so I was always
the operational COO type person.
[00:06:04]
They call it a firm
administrator and law firms.
[00:06:06]
And so I would run these
million dollar companies.
[00:06:08]
And I handled the business
side of business, right.
[00:06:12]
Accounting, marketing it.
[00:06:14]
And, of course, HR.
[00:06:16]
And then the deliverables
the process and all that stuff.
[00:06:22]
I had internalized the process,
but I had never thought about it.
[00:06:25]
So then when I went on to be
[00:06:27]
an operational consultant, I was like,
just answering whatever they need,
[00:06:32]
meeting the business owner where
they were to give them answers.
[00:06:35]
Consultants tell you what to do.
[00:06:36]
Coaches help you figure it out.
[00:06:38]
Way too impatient to be a coach.
[00:06:40]
I could never do it.
[00:06:41]
I want to tell you the answer.
[00:06:43]
You can act on it or not.
[00:06:44]
But let’s just get to the heart of it.
[00:06:46]
This is how we can do it successfully.
[00:06:49]
After several years,
[00:06:51]
there was a dearth of business coaches,
which I was often compared to.
[00:06:55]
And I was like, I feel like
there’s something speaking to me.
[00:06:58]
So I went back over all of my cases
[00:07:00]
for seven years, and I found
out very interesting thing.
[00:07:05]
Every single client,
[00:07:06]
whether I worked with them for 1 hour or
one year, had the same two questions.
[00:07:11]
How do I find good people and what
do I do if I have to fire them?
[00:07:16]
And so I was consulting on that, like,
consistently with everything else.
[00:07:21]
So I thought I can’t be
inventing the wheel here, right?
[00:07:25]
That imposter syndrome thing hanging over
[00:07:27]
my head telling me, there’s got to be a
thing out there, but I couldn’t find it.
[00:07:32]
What I found was that business owners only
[00:07:34]
got information on organizational
structuring and really internalizing these
[00:07:39]
processes from the kind of people like,
when they could join $100,000 a year
[00:07:44]
masterminds,
they would fly in an organizational
[00:07:47]
structure person who would just do it
for you because you’re paying 100,000.
[00:07:50]
You got to do that.
[00:07:52]
So I was like, I want to get to this
growing entrepreneur market,
[00:07:55]
the business owners that are like,
I want to deliver this beautiful idea
[00:07:59]
concept service to people,
but I can’t do it myself.
[00:08:03]
How do I get the people?
[00:08:05]
And it’s kept the businesses small for so
[00:08:07]
long that I was just like,
I had to figure it out.
[00:08:10]
So the first year, once we identified it
[00:08:13]
was a need, and it was something
people were going to pay for.
[00:08:16]
The first year we delivered it
and developed it in person.
[00:08:19]
We only had one on one client.
[00:08:21]
And then the second year in 2019,
we created the digital version,
[00:08:25]
and then 2020 was going to be
the year of the conference.
[00:08:33]
But I’m happy to say it’s 2021.
[00:08:35]
And we just had our first conference
and it was a huge success.
[00:08:38]
So I’m really excited to get
the mission out there.
[00:08:41]
So you had a conference?
[00:08:43]
Oh, no, I did say the wrong word.
I attended.
[00:08:45]
I am not interested
in hosting a conference.
[00:08:47]
Okay.
I’m not that I would go insane.
[00:08:51]
That would not be for me.
[00:08:54]
But I love to go to the conferences.
[00:08:56]
I speak all the time.
[00:08:57]
And it’s just the energy of being around
[00:08:59]
the people that are so excited about their
businesses, hearing all their ideas.
[00:09:04]
I know you get it right,
[00:09:05]
because what you do, man, you get to talk
business with business, about business.
[00:09:10]
It’s so energizing.
I love it.
[00:09:12]
Yeah.
I totally love it as well.
[00:09:14]
I know that.
[00:09:15]
So when you came up with your system,
[00:09:18]
was it you learned from, I guess,
dealing with the attorneys and all
[00:09:22]
that kind of stuff which had
to be challenging.
[00:09:24]
Yes.
But I like working with egos,
[00:09:26]
and that’s why I went to business
owners and entrepreneurs.
[00:09:29]
Right.
I can’t tell you what your business needs.
[00:09:31]
I can tell you how to build
it for your business.
[00:09:33]
I can tell you what kind of people are
going to be successful in that business.
[00:09:37]
But I want you to know what’s
driving your business, right?
[00:09:41]
Interesting. And so how things been
going so far with your business?
[00:09:45]
Holy Batman.
Really?
[00:09:47]
Well, I will tell you the first
two years, we’re hard, right?
[00:09:52]
When you’re developing something new
[00:09:54]
because it wasn’t like I could go out
there and take eight different hiring
[00:09:58]
process programs and bring it in and try
to create my own twist on it.
[00:10:03]
Right?
Literally.
[00:10:03]
It wasn’t out there.
[00:10:04]
The SBA tells you to start with this
template of an employment ad.
[00:10:08]
And I would tell SBA Small Business
Association administration my brain.
[00:10:15]
I didn’t mention four days talking, right.
[00:10:18]
Small Business Administration.
[00:10:19]
So they tell you to start
at the employment ad.
[00:10:21]
And here’s a template.
[00:10:22]
But Boss actions,
[00:10:24]
we believe that it starts so many more
steps before that,
[00:10:28]
because otherwise you’re just
attracting somebody else’s people.
[00:10:32]
And the employment ad
is an attraction tool.
[00:10:34]
By the way, it is not a management tool.
[00:10:36]
And so you have to learn how to write one
that will get you the person for what you
[00:10:41]
need right now in your business
that will serve your clients.
[00:10:45]
Does that make sense?
It does.
[00:10:47]
Yeah.
[00:10:47]
So I imagine this is a process
that has been refined and probably
[00:10:54]
refined.
Yeah.
[00:10:55]
Definitely.
In fact, this last year,
[00:10:58]
the beginning of the year, last 2020,
we went deep on messaging.
[00:11:03]
Since we couldn’t be out there,
we started doing more and more and more
[00:11:06]
market research just in the community
of entrepreneurs and business owners.
[00:11:10]
And then 2021,
we started by going into our client base
[00:11:14]
and the people that were really working
the program and buying the program.
[00:11:18]
And we wanted to get a better, bigger
version of what we were delivering.
[00:11:22]
And so our program is called Bossification
[00:11:24]
and so we just were like,
tell us your pain.
[00:11:28]
Tell us what you want.
Tell us what you need.
[00:11:29]
Tell us what you don’t like what you do.
[00:11:30]
Like, tell us the pain.
[00:11:32]
Bring on the pain.
[00:11:33]
And it was easily my favorite project
that I’ve worked on in years.
[00:11:37]
It was so fun.
[00:11:38]
We talked to 50 different people very
[00:11:41]
specifically about their pain
and their hopes and dreams.
[00:11:45]
And that was just fun to get to spend
[00:11:47]
the time doing that, learning all about
what they really wanted from a team.
[00:11:51]
Interesting.
Yeah.
[00:11:52]
I want to ask you about something that’s
[00:11:54]
been bugging me, and it’s probably
been bugging me, at least to a point.
[00:11:57]
Okay.
Tell me.
[00:12:01]
I get a lot of resumes when I throw an ad
[00:12:03]
out there, and I would
say at least 50% of them.
[00:12:09]
The people in that 50%
[00:12:13]
pocket have held any job that they
have had for less than six months.
[00:12:20]
There have been many
jobs that they have had.
[00:12:22]
They feel like they have to list every
[00:12:23]
one, even the ones that they spent
two days at put them on their resume.
[00:12:28]
I’m thinking I see a common denominator
[00:12:30]
here when I was off
working for other people.
[00:12:34]
If I were to put a resume out there,
[00:12:35]
if I was ever at a job for two days,
I don’t believe I was.
[00:12:39]
I’ll never put it on my resume.
[00:12:42]
They’re trying to just look good, right?
[00:12:44]
They want to show experience.
[00:12:46]
The reason most people put a lot is so
that they’re hoping you’re going to go.
[00:12:50]
Oh, I used to run a deli shop, and they
looked they worked at a deli shop.
[00:12:53]
At least they’re going to know
my vernacular, my vocabulary the way.
[00:12:57]
Like, if I say Ham on Swiss,
they’re going to know what that means.
[00:13:01]
So I think that that’s
what they’re looking for.
[00:13:04]
But if the question is longevity, really,
you worked at three jobs for six months.
[00:13:10]
There’s a couple of things
to be thinking about there.
[00:13:12]
The first one is going to hurt
a little bit, everybody.
[00:13:14]
So hang on.
[00:13:16]
The truth of the matter is in our current
[00:13:18]
climate, 2021 that’s we’re talking
in the fall,
[00:13:23]
and I would tell you that small business
can expect a good tenure from a really
[00:13:29]
good employee because
they’re all out there.
[00:13:30]
There are great people that want
to work for all of you.
[00:13:33]
For you, James, for me, for everybody,
a good tenure is 18 to 36 months.
[00:13:40]
Wow.
That’s sink in for a second.
[00:13:42]
Yeah.
[00:13:44]
I’m going to do everything
I can to make that longer.
[00:13:46]
On my end, I’ll be
the exception to the rule.
[00:13:48]
Okay, well, that’s okay.
[00:13:49]
There’s totally ways you
can affect that, right?
[00:13:51]
Create tenure and loyalty.
Absolutely.
[00:13:53]
Showing up as the best possible boss.
[00:13:56]
It’s who we hire and how we hire 100%.
[00:13:59]
But it is equal parts to affect
[00:14:01]
that tenure and loyalty that comes
from the way we show up as a boss.
[00:14:06]
The way we manage them now.
[00:14:08]
That can be longer, right.
[00:14:10]
You can get like three because
1836 months is three years, right?
[00:14:15]
Three to five years you can expect
from a manager type or a supervisor type
[00:14:19]
or somebody that’s kind
of like at that layer.
[00:14:21]
And they really are helping you
with all the machinations, right.
[00:14:24]
The movements in your business right now.
Yes.
[00:14:28]
You know, someone that had someone
that worked for them for 15 years.
[00:14:32]
But I will tell you
this that’s the rarity.
[00:14:35]
And while we will look for that,
[00:14:38]
we can’t hire for that,
what we need to do is we need to look
[00:14:40]
at our business, identify what we need
right now, learn how to attract
[00:14:46]
that to us, and then put them through
a vetting process that makes them prove
[00:14:51]
they can do the job we need right now,
not hiring for potential.
[00:14:57]
So hear me clearly,
stop hiring for potential.
[00:15:02]
Small business owners do not have the time
or the resources or the energy to grow
[00:15:08]
a business with people that are
learning to do their jobs.
[00:15:13]
Yeah.
[00:15:14]
One of the businesses I sold,
I remember selling to this guy.
[00:15:16]
And one of the best pieces of advice
that he gave me is that when it comes
[00:15:20]
to employees, no projects,
never hire a project.
[00:15:26]
I know.
[00:15:26]
But in good or bad, business owners and
entrepreneurs are just so darn hopeful.
[00:15:32]
Like my clients all have
the biggest hearts.
[00:15:36]
They just want a team that gets along and
loves what they do as much as they do.
[00:15:40]
And that’s okay.
And that’s great.
[00:15:42]
But if we are taking the time to hire
[00:15:44]
people, we like to teach them how to do
a job that your business needs already.
[00:15:49]
Your business is not being
served by this time.
[00:15:51]
And then by the time we could
possibly train them up.
[00:15:55]
Let’s magically say six
months was the time.
[00:15:58]
By the time.
[00:15:59]
Then if we’ve got them trained,
your business doesn’t need it yet because
[00:16:04]
you hired somebody else to do that,
or it’s the other way.
[00:16:07]
They’re trained and ready.
That would work out.
[00:16:10]
Yeah.
So our business doesn’t need them
[00:16:12]
at the same time as they’re ready
to take on the full responsibility.
[00:16:16]
And so now we have a disconnect, right.
[00:16:18]
So we’re still underserved because we
[00:16:19]
don’t have the right person or they’re
ready for the job and they’re going to go
[00:16:23]
to the place that’s going to give them
the bigger bang now that you train them.
[00:16:26]
And that just creates this horrible,
horrible cycle in your business.
[00:16:30]
That was great.
Advice is what I’m saying.
[00:16:32]
Yeah, I like it.
That’s very true.
[00:16:34]
It’s interesting.
I read another article.
[00:16:37]
Oh, my gosh.
[00:16:38]
I can’t remember where or who it was
written by, but essentially, the Gist was
[00:16:43]
speaking on businesses in general,
small, big, whatever.
[00:16:47]
But essentially said that the goal
[00:16:48]
of business is not to create jobs,
even though we, as a society,
[00:16:52]
want to feel that it is the goal
of the business is to be profitable.
[00:16:56]
I agree with that.
[00:16:58]
I am a capitalist.
[00:16:59]
I believe that a business has
[00:17:00]
a responsibility to create profit,
even not for profits.
[00:17:05]
Create profit.
[00:17:06]
They use it differently.
[00:17:08]
And if your business isn’t creating
[00:17:10]
the kind of capital that lets you get
the resources inside your business
[00:17:15]
to begin to start to create a profit,
it’s not going to grow.
[00:17:19]
Yeah.
Interesting.
[00:17:21]
I want to ask you if you have ever run
into a manager or pain in the butt boss
[00:17:26]
of some kind that you just are like,
oh, you’re the problem.
[00:17:30]
Oh, yeah, a lot.
[00:17:32]
But
[00:17:34]
honestly, a lot of my clients will say
that they think they’re the problem.
[00:17:39]
Usually, again, it’s just something
that they don’t know, right.
[00:17:43]
So they might be I’m too friendly.
[00:17:49]
I let them decide their own schedule,
whatever the thing is that’s oftentimes we
[00:17:53]
worry we’re being too friendly,
and that is a big deal.
[00:17:57]
It’s trying to create this
culture of being liked, right.
[00:18:02]
And we think we’re being empathetic.
[00:18:04]
There’s a book called Radical Candor
by Kim Scott, and so she has a great
[00:18:08]
difference of explaining
compassion and empathy.
[00:18:11]
And that’s a really big
thing for business owners.
[00:18:14]
We think empathy is the thing
that will get us a great culture.
[00:18:19]
Oh, I know.
[00:18:20]
I’m so sorry in that moment and feeling
that pain with them instead of saying,
[00:18:25]
I can understand your pain,
but compassionately.
[00:18:28]
I’m sorry you’re in that pain.
[00:18:30]
However, my business how
we would say boss actions.
[00:18:33]
My business has needs,
[00:18:35]
and so those have to do with fulfilling
the expectations you and I laid out.
[00:18:40]
Now, we teach you to say it
in a more conversational way.
[00:18:42]
If you need to, we teach you
to say it in a very stark way.
[00:18:45]
Every boss has to learn that there are
[00:18:48]
a lot of people that are trying to be
a great boss,
[00:18:51]
but are not stepping into that boss role
of being the business champion
[00:18:56]
and a business owner entrepreneur
must protect that business.
[00:19:01]
You’re in charge.
[00:19:03]
You’re the champion.
[00:19:04]
No one’s going to fight
for that company like you.
[00:19:06]
And that means you have to take
[00:19:07]
responsibility for the people
and the actions that you let influence.
[00:19:10]
Yeah.
I love you saying that because I am
[00:19:13]
a person that does not have
a whole lot of empathy.
[00:19:15]
So when I have an employee that’s like,
hey, my cat is sick.
[00:19:18]
I’m like, I don’t care well,
and that’s okay.
[00:19:22]
It’s also okay to not care.
[00:19:24]
However, I don’t say that I don’t care.
[00:19:27]
I’m just like, great.
[00:19:29]
That’s hilarious.
I love cats.
[00:19:31]
I totally give a cat story, too.
When I’m talking with the clients,
[00:19:33]
I say things like, I’ll be like, Look,
yes, you don’t care that they had to make
[00:19:38]
Miffy the cat, Cook their
dinner for them and shred it.
[00:19:42]
And Miffy hardly ate anything.
[00:19:44]
But we do need to create the space to
allow them to share that moment with us.
[00:19:47]
Because it’s creating trust,
[00:19:49]
and it’s creating an opportunity
for us to continue as a team.
[00:19:52]
Right?
[00:19:54]
Compassion comes from understanding
the person that is doing the job.
[00:19:59]
So we do need to offset that.
[00:20:02]
But the job needs this
[00:20:03]
with an understanding
for the humanity side of it.
[00:20:06]
And there is a way to be that, boss.
[00:20:08]
And I think it’s in the fun of small
[00:20:10]
business and creating your own team
that you get to decide how much
[00:20:13]
of that compassion you led to, like,
my people, if somebody comes in today,
[00:20:17]
even at the conference, as I imagine,
we were at the conference with my team
[00:20:20]
and somebody that day woke up like
just throwing up and sick and horrible.
[00:20:26]
I needed people working,
[00:20:28]
but I also want them to feel I’m like,
I want you to just go right.
[00:20:32]
And I guess that was a little harsh,
[00:20:34]
but I was trying to think of something
else where they just
[00:20:37]
maybe they had lost a family member
a month ago and it was just a day they
[00:20:41]
woke up and they literally
couldn’t stop crying.
[00:20:44]
If you’ve ever lost somebody,
you know, it hits you out of nowhere.
[00:20:47]
Sure.
[00:20:47]
As a small business owner,
I get to do my team the way I want to.
[00:20:51]
And what I know is I wouldn’t care if I
[00:20:53]
got five more sales because
that person was on the floor that day.
[00:20:56]
I get to Bosco.
[00:20:58]
I really want you to go
to your room and just relax.
[00:21:01]
It’s okay.
[00:21:01]
Everybody has that human moment and small
business you can build that in.
[00:21:07]
If that’s a company thing, you can build
that kind of compassion into your team.
[00:21:11]
But it has to start from defining what
[00:21:14]
success is and consistently holding
people accountable for that success.
[00:21:18]
You have a successful employee
and they have a compassionate need.
[00:21:23]
You get to take advantage and be
that awesome boss that you dreamed about.
[00:21:27]
And that’s where it’s a sticky wicket.
[00:21:30]
So you do have to learn the steps
in the dance a little bit.
[00:21:33]
Yeah, it’s interesting.
[00:21:34]
Maybe I’m an anomaly or something like
that, but I have a very hard time.
[00:21:39]
I think one of the worst things that I
have to suffer through is listening
[00:21:42]
to somebody else tell me about their
problems when it comes to something that I
[00:21:45]
don’t find relevant to the
relationship that we have.
[00:21:51]
Let me ask you this.
[00:21:52]
How are you going to get them
to give a crud about your business?
[00:21:56]
If you can’t give a crud about them,
[00:22:00]
I told you it’s going to hurt, man.
[00:22:03]
I know the issues.
[00:22:05]
We don’t want them to just show up and do
[00:22:07]
the job because they’re not
going to do a good enough job.
[00:22:09]
We need them to like the job and want
[00:22:11]
to serve the business or complete
the project or build the widget.
[00:22:15]
They have to be invested in the product
and the people you’re serving.
[00:22:19]
And that implies compassion,
caring consideration for them.
[00:22:22]
And if you can’t give them the Grace
[00:22:25]
of that time, I’m sorry I
told you it’s going to be.
[00:22:27]
I’m like, this is the boss.
[00:22:29]
Oh, this is cool, because this works out.
[00:22:31]
This is all my relationships, right?
[00:22:33]
Employee?
[00:22:36]
I don’t care.
[00:22:38]
Our relationship doesn’t address
or doesn’t come near that.
[00:22:42]
Ask you about that.
[00:22:43]
I don’t want to know about that because
[00:22:45]
you just want them
to care about your stuff.
[00:22:46]
But you don’t want to care about theirs.
[00:22:48]
No, because I don’t have a cat.
I’m not a cat person.
[00:22:51]
But if I did my cat puked this morning,
[00:22:53]
I wouldn’t be like, hey,
tailmar my cat puked this morning.
[00:22:56]
I know.
[00:22:57]
But you do care about your business
and you care about your clients, right.
[00:23:01]
So you want to get on in that conversation
[00:23:04]
where they’re talking about the cat, the
thing they care about, you want to get.
[00:23:08]
Yeah.
[00:23:09]
Can we get to the point where we’re
talking about the thing I care about?
[00:23:11]
Right?
This is given to what we pay them for.
[00:23:14]
Yes, it is what we pay them for.
[00:23:15]
But again, you can have
a team that just does it.
[00:23:18]
And you can be that guy or that girl.
[00:23:20]
Whoever it is where you’re just like,
look, just get the Ding work done.
[00:23:25]
Why are we having this talk in circles?
[00:23:27]
I don’t know why I have
spent the time and energy.
[00:23:29]
You will still be able to build a team,
and they will still do an okay job.
[00:23:33]
Okay.
But if you can find a way to understand
[00:23:36]
that when you have the right person
who cares about all this helps, too.
[00:23:41]
But when you have a person that cares
[00:23:43]
about what you’re doing and why you’re
doing it and how the people on the other
[00:23:46]
end are receiving it,
you actually do start to care.
[00:23:49]
So one I would challenge,
[00:23:51]
do you have a team that you
trust and like to do the job?
[00:23:54]
Very much so.
Oh, do you that’s fantastic.
[00:23:57]
Yeah.
We have a fantastic team.
[00:23:58]
I love that.
We fought hard to get there.
[00:24:00]
Like it’s been over ten years.
[00:24:02]
We fought hard, but the culture has been
[00:24:05]
something that I have
worked extremely hard on.
[00:24:09]
And I feel like the crew has
worked extremely hard on as well.
[00:24:12]
So you’re probably then not as harsh
[00:24:14]
on the employees as you’re
making it sound in this example.
[00:24:16]
No, I wouldn’t say harsh. I feel like,
[00:24:22]
how do I want to say this when somebody
[00:24:24]
mentions that they’re having a problem
or otherwise?
[00:24:28]
Yeah, it’s a great example.
[00:24:29]
The crew as a whole is able to address
that, and they do it very well.
[00:24:34]
Fantastic.
[00:24:34]
I have to just ignore that communication
channel because I’m like,
[00:24:37]
why aren’t you working?
And as long as I ignore that communication
[00:24:41]
channel, I essentially consider
it outsourced empathy.
[00:24:47]
First of all, outsourced empathy
is totally going into my program.
[00:24:50]
But it is exactly that right.
[00:24:52]
I remind people you can hire the human
resource part, the hiring part.
[00:24:58]
You can bring in people to handle this,
but it’s going to take the boss first
[00:25:04]
learning what is success
in the business, right?
[00:25:07]
What does a successful customer service
representative need to bring with them do?
[00:25:13]
Because your customer service
representative and my customer service
[00:25:16]
representative surely would
never be the same person.
[00:25:19]
And that’s okay.
[00:25:20]
But we have to learn how to write
[00:25:22]
the employment ad and do the interviewing
and the reference checks and all
[00:25:26]
the things so that and how to manage those
people so that they can be successful.
[00:25:30]
But we have to attract the people
[00:25:33]
that will care about the job
and can work with us.
[00:25:35]
Right.
So my big thing is, I talk too fast.
[00:25:39]
I don’t know if you’ve noticed that yet.
[00:25:41]
You and me both are coming 3 hours worth
of stuff here in less than an hour.
[00:25:45]
I love it.
Right?
[00:25:47]
So when I interview, I have to look
for team members that can hear quickly.
[00:25:52]
Now.
[00:25:52]
They don’t all have to be able
to speak as quickly as I do.
[00:25:58]
And some of them even need to take
[00:25:59]
the information and go
away and come back later.
[00:26:01]
They’ll be like, okay, I got it.
[00:26:02]
I’ll let you know what my thoughts are
later, but I found I can’t when I hire
[00:26:07]
somebody that needs me to slow down,
it’s not successful because
[00:26:13]
I want to heck with me.
[00:26:15]
I want to keep moving.
[00:26:16]
I want to talk quickly,
[00:26:17]
get you my information,
and I want to go to the next thing.
[00:26:20]
I like operating at that high frequency.
[00:26:22]
So like, you
[00:26:25]
know, if I have a need for somebody
[00:26:27]
to take over that outsource piece,
whatever it is for me,
[00:26:30]
a big part of its marketing because I
market like, I talk too many words.
[00:26:34]
So then I bring in my marketing person
and they coordinate all this stuff.
[00:26:38]
So yes, you can outsource the HR,
[00:26:41]
but the person you have in charge
of that you trust, you know, you like,
[00:26:44]
you’ve vetted and they’re great
with the team that you want.
[00:26:47]
They’re building a team that you like.
[00:26:50]
They’re conversing.
[00:26:51]
They’re doing that time and energy
that you don’t want to do.
[00:26:54]
And that’s exactly what
building a team is about.
[00:26:57]
But you had to take the time to define
what that culture was going to be like,
[00:27:00]
what you cared about and what you didn’t,
whether you worked with experts
[00:27:04]
and coaches and peer groups
and masterminds to define that culture
[00:27:07]
before you build it or you brought
in an employee that was the person
[00:27:12]
that was the expert and then
you internally created it.
[00:27:15]
You the boss, took the time to understand
[00:27:17]
what was needed and that’s the only way
a business can grow a successful team
[00:27:22]
because it’s always going to come back
to you and how you operate and how you
[00:27:26]
communicate and what your clients
were attracted to you about.
[00:27:30]
Your team has to be able
to deliver on in a lot of ways.
[00:27:33]
So if we’re not hiring people that can
[00:27:36]
work the way you work, at least in some
way, it’s going to be a disconnect fair.
[00:27:41]
Totally fair.
Yeah.
[00:27:43]
In regards to the whole culture thing,
I would love to say that I had
[00:27:47]
the fourth Hunt, I guess, to bring
on somebody that knew what was going on.
[00:27:51]
But what happened was we ended up
with a less than great employee.
[00:27:54]
That was just a dark cloud smart girl.
[00:27:58]
But just she was a dark
cloud everywhere she went.
[00:28:00]
I understand exactly what
you’re talking about.
[00:28:02]
And that brought the whole culture
[00:28:04]
of the business down to a point that I
noticed I was like, wait a second.
[00:28:08]
This isn’t good.
Yeah.
[00:28:10]
You figure out like, okay, well,
as soon as we hired her,
[00:28:12]
it was essentially like a light switch
where all of a sudden it’s dark Gray.
[00:28:17]
One person can do it.
[00:28:18]
It was crazy.
[00:28:21]
In a small office like that
caused that much damage.
[00:28:25]
We got rid of her, and it still took
us six months to recover from that.
[00:28:29]
It’s a hard shift, right?
[00:28:30]
Oh, my gosh.
[00:28:32]
It was crazy.
[00:28:33]
Well, so there’s a couple of things,
sometimes the dark cloud part.
[00:28:37]
It’s funny that you say
that I make a joke.
[00:28:40]
I’m militantly positive.
[00:28:42]
So when I hire, I like,
[00:28:44]
you only want to be surrounded by people
that are positive and hopeful,
[00:28:48]
and that’s a big part of what we give our
clients that you can build this team,
[00:28:52]
and you will find people that are
awesome because they’re out there.
[00:28:55]
The big thing with that is that person was
[00:28:58]
likely misaligned with either
the industry, the way you serve the people
[00:29:02]
you serve or misaligned
with what they were doing.
[00:29:05]
So somebody can be an expert
in something and hate their own job.
[00:29:09]
Somebody can be an expert at something and
hate the kind of people you work with.
[00:29:16]
And it’s going to absolutely affect
[00:29:18]
everybody else who loves
the people you work with.
[00:29:20]
It’s going to affect everybody
else who loves what they do.
[00:29:23]
And that is where that kind of some people
[00:29:26]
are unhappy because they don’t
like this kind of job, right?
[00:29:30]
If I’m stuck in, if I was in marketing
and I had to format things and make it
[00:29:33]
perfectly centered, I would lose my mind,
and I would not be a happy person.
[00:29:38]
So I know that about myself,
and I would not go for that job.
[00:29:41]
So most bosses then say, so,
why are they trying for the job?
[00:29:44]
Because they do not know that they
can take control of the situation.
[00:29:47]
They’ve never known anything
outside of being an employee.
[00:29:50]
And somebody once told them that they were
[00:29:52]
good at what they’re doing
so they can pay the bills.
[00:29:55]
So they just keeps.
And trudging along.
[00:29:57]
We can’t fix everybody, and that’s okay.
[00:29:59]
It’s not our job,
but you can start to bring that alignment
[00:30:02]
into your hiring process,
and we can create ways to vet out the way
[00:30:08]
they’re going to connect
with the team on a hole.
[00:30:11]
So we want to connect them with the team
[00:30:13]
with the industry or your
audience or who you serve, right.
[00:30:16]
And then also with the position itself.
[00:30:18]
These are really critical.
All right.
[00:30:20]
Yeah.
[00:30:22]
I like to think that we’re
following those steps.
[00:30:24]
But so far, it sounds great, man.
[00:30:27]
Well, we didn’t know at first it was like,
hey, you sound good answering the phone.
[00:30:32]
And are you smart enough
to figure out where to go?
[00:30:35]
A to B.
Yeah.
[00:30:37]
You’re hired it’s all good.
[00:30:38]
And they probably did go to A to B.
Really?
[00:30:40]
Well.
[00:30:44]
Some people’s idea of being able to work
independently, and our idea of being able
[00:30:47]
to work independently are
two very different things.
[00:30:49]
Yeah.
Absolutely.
[00:30:51]
And we didn’t find those out with a lot
of people until after we hired them.
[00:30:55]
I’m sorry, not what goes on,
but that’s the big key.
[00:30:59]
That’s the big thing we built.
[00:31:02]
The reason we had to do so much time
on messaging is we built this hiring
[00:31:06]
process and we thought it was the sexiest
beast in the universe, and we’re like,
[00:31:09]
everybody’s going to want
this, and they did.
[00:31:11]
But it wasn’t the thing that was
the buy now situation, right?
[00:31:14]
They’re like, I do,
but I’m not really hiring yet.
[00:31:17]
Well, let me tell you people, you are.
[00:31:19]
You hired a vendor bookkeeper.
[00:31:21]
You hired an independent contractor
[00:31:24]
through your attorney
that did your contracts.
[00:31:26]
You have a social media person that’s
[00:31:29]
either through independent contractor,
you have a team as soon as you are letting
[00:31:33]
people influence your business,
and that success.
[00:31:36]
And the way you show up or deliver,
you are now a manager.
[00:31:40]
You are now a boss.
[00:31:41]
And so it’s about learning the steps
[00:31:43]
of only letting the right
people into any of those roles.
[00:31:47]
We created that step by step process so
that we have more control of the kind
[00:31:52]
of successful person
we’re letting in before.
[00:31:55]
We don’t want to say you’re hired.
Now prove it to me.
[00:31:58]
Now we say, prove it
to me before I hire you.
[00:32:00]
Right.
Interesting.
[00:32:02]
Yeah.
[00:32:02]
I see
what have been some of the challenges
[00:32:05]
that you run into with this
whole boss business.
[00:32:09]
That’s one of the big things, right.
[00:32:10]
So we thought everybody was going to want
[00:32:12]
a hiring process, like, originally,
we did not do the management piece of it.
[00:32:16]
In 2018.
[00:32:18]
We were just all about the hiring.
[00:32:20]
But as we were working with one on one,
we found that we were consulting
[00:32:23]
on managing with them because
we were still developing.
[00:32:28]
But we kept leading sales
with hiring, right.
[00:32:30]
You can learn to hire, right?
[00:32:32]
You can learn to hire, right.
[00:32:34]
And it was okay.
[00:32:35]
But when we really went to
[00:32:39]
adding the management piece
into the whole program, right.
[00:32:42]
Because there’s a process to that,
and we used to sell it separately.
[00:32:44]
Do you want the managing
or do you want the hiring?
[00:32:47]
All right.
It was separate.
[00:32:49]
We put it all together,
and we really need to look,
[00:32:53]
if you’ve got an underperformer and you
have to have that really difficult
[00:32:56]
discussion,
look, it’s time to step up or step out.
[00:33:00]
That’s what we call it
[00:33:02]
as a boss still have to step
back and identify things again.
[00:33:05]
We have to decide, are they going to stay
or are they going to go?
[00:33:11]
All right.
And it’s about what I want.
[00:33:14]
Do I the boss want them to stay or do I
the boss want them to go and really
[00:33:20]
truthfully, 90% of the time,
I ask you to tell you this, ask yourself,
[00:33:25]
do you trust that they
could do the job again?
[00:33:27]
Right.
[00:33:27]
Maybe they made one little mistake many
times, and you’re frustrated by that?
[00:33:32]
Like they just can’t show up on time.
[00:33:34]
Maybe they’ll never care.
[00:33:35]
Maybe they will.
[00:33:36]
But is it enough to say, I don’t
trust that they’ll ever be on time?
[00:33:41]
And if you don’t, then that means it’s
time to terminate and let them go.
[00:33:45]
All right.
[00:33:46]
There’s more to it
in conversation and stuff.
[00:33:48]
But that’s my little tip for everybody
writing down actionable steps today.
[00:33:53]
If you’ve lost that trust,
I don’t believe they can do it.
[00:33:57]
They have to go now,
[00:34:00]
if you know, in your heart or hearts,
it’s not going to come back.
[00:34:03]
Don’t believe they’ll ever do it.
Right.
[00:34:05]
Get them out.
[00:34:06]
You know, it’s interesting.
[00:34:07]
I can totally see that
[00:34:10]
when I find myself pausing before I have
a difficult conversation with an employee
[00:34:15]
like that, I do the math to figure out
how much is an employee costing me.
[00:34:19]
If I keep them.
[00:34:21]
How much more will it cost me
and then add in stress and energy?
[00:34:26]
It’s not just money.
[00:34:27]
I mean, it really is the chaos
that comes from waiting.
[00:34:31]
Yeah. We’ll call it goodwill, right?
Yeah.
[00:34:33]
Goodwill.
Whatever.
[00:34:36]
There’s the stuff on top of the cash.
[00:34:38]
They’re just like, okay,
we’re having this conversation right now.
[00:34:41]
It’s accessing before it spreads.
Well.
[00:34:44]
And so let’s go back
to the very nice boss, right.
[00:34:47]
Which we agree.
[00:34:48]
Both of us are more of a get
it done kind of people.
[00:34:51]
We get it.
[00:34:51]
But the majority of bosses
out there want to be nice.
[00:34:54]
And that’s why they don’t want
to have the conversation.
[00:34:56]
And they think to themselves,
[00:34:59]
I’m going to give James one more chance.
[00:35:02]
I’m going to let him go.
[00:35:03]
I’m going to give him one more chance.
[00:35:05]
I’m sure he’s going
to figure it out on his own.
[00:35:07]
And then here’s a couple of things
in that whole thought process.
[00:35:11]
If you really want to give your employees
a chance, if you really want to help your
[00:35:15]
team be successful,
you need to let them know immediately when
[00:35:20]
they make a mistake because
they cannot read your mind.
[00:35:26]
They don’t know that they
weren’t successful.
[00:35:28]
So if you really want to give your people
a chance, you have the conversation
[00:35:33]
immediately, because once we tell
them what success looks like.
[00:35:37]
Hey, James, I meant
to talk to you about it.
[00:35:39]
You wore your blue shirt on Wednesday,
and we wear white shirts on Wednesday.
[00:35:44]
So next Wednesday,
what color are you going to wear?
[00:35:47]
Blue?
Right.
[00:35:48]
Tell him immediately.
[00:35:50]
Now he has a chance of being successful
in the future, waiting for him to figure
[00:35:55]
it out because it’s obvious to you or
you feel like you’ve said it before.
[00:35:59]
Whatever happened in that communication,
they didn’t get the message.
[00:36:03]
But if we walk in Wednesday morning
and you’re wearing the white shirt and I’m
[00:36:07]
like, Jane, let’s come have
a conversation with me.
[00:36:10]
And I just say, I think you know that we
have the different kinds of shirts.
[00:36:15]
And I noticed that you’re
wearing the wrong shirt today.
[00:36:17]
This is a shirt I need you
to wear on Wednesdays.
[00:36:20]
Do you have any questions?
All right.
[00:36:22]
Do you feel like you’re going to be
able to do this next Wednesday?
[00:36:24]
Excellent.
All right.
[00:36:25]
I’m giving you the chance
to be successful.
[00:36:28]
So it works.
I like it.
[00:36:31]
Well, let me back up a step here.
[00:36:34]
Have you ever given
somebody a boss advice?
[00:36:36]
They’ve taken it.
[00:36:37]
And the employees, for whatever reason,
just didn’t follow suit.
[00:36:41]
Absolutely.
Yeah.
[00:36:43]
And I’ve hired badly,
and my clients have hired badly.
[00:36:46]
So here’s the horribleness of my industry.
[00:36:50]
People are human, and it’s not
that they’re horrible humans.
[00:36:55]
So hear me out for a little bit.
[00:36:56]
So the main thing is the day you hire
[00:36:59]
somebody, all they want to do
is be the world’s best boss.
[00:37:03]
They’re like, I’m going to get in there.
[00:37:05]
James is going to love me.
[00:37:07]
He’s going to be like,
I never had anybody as good as me.
[00:37:10]
He’s so lucky I’m going to rock his world.
[00:37:12]
The priority is to make the boss happy.
[00:37:15]
I swear, the first day,
all they want is to be successful.
[00:37:18]
However we’re people.
[00:37:20]
So our priorities change.
[00:37:21]
So right that day, make the boss happy
is above pick up the kids from school.
[00:37:27]
It’s above, go to the grocery store,
[00:37:28]
it’s above, go to Vegas
and gamble whatever it is.
[00:37:31]
Right.
[00:37:32]
And so as life goes on,
their priorities shift, right?
[00:37:36]
Maybe it’s pick up kids from school one
[00:37:39]
day, make the boss happy because it’s just
the kid was sick that day or whatever.
[00:37:44]
Their priority shift.
[00:37:45]
But major priorities can shift.
[00:37:47]
And that’s where we start to see
a difference in how they show up.
[00:37:50]
Right.
So we need to make sure that we are
[00:37:53]
thinking about what could
be changing for our team.
[00:37:57]
What else is going on?
[00:37:58]
Right?
[00:37:59]
In 2019, I had to move my mom
in and walk her through end of life.
[00:38:03]
So you got to know I wasn’t showing
up as the best me every day.
[00:38:06]
My priority was my mom.
[00:38:09]
The second priority was my clients,
but I took less clients.
[00:38:12]
I delivered, of course, for my clients,
[00:38:14]
I made myself available, and I was
transparent at what was going on, right.
[00:38:18]
Because I’m fortunate
enough that I can do that.
[00:38:20]
And that’s my part of my business model.
[00:38:22]
Not everybody gets to do that.
I get it.
[00:38:24]
But your employees are
doing the same thing.
[00:38:27]
So when their priority shifts,
[00:38:28]
and now they have a sick kid or
a family member or whatever.
[00:38:33]
If we’re in communication,
we can understand the likelihood
[00:38:37]
that they’ll be able to come
back and reengage with us.
[00:38:40]
What kind of time period is that?
Right?
[00:38:42]
My mom was passing,
and it took six months.
[00:38:46]
If I had an employer,
[00:38:47]
I would not have been able to tell
them how long this would drag out.
[00:38:50]
And so if you’ve got the relationship
and you can value your employees,
[00:38:54]
you can understand whether your business
can survive to have somebody in or out.
[00:38:58]
We don’t always get to be
the empathetic boss.
[00:39:01]
We have to protect our business.
[00:39:04]
Small business.
[00:39:06]
If I didn’t show up at all for six months,
I would have lost a job.
[00:39:09]
I would have lost my clients for sure.
Right.
[00:39:12]
But somebody needs to prioritize their
family, their health or something.
[00:39:15]
It’s okay.
It’s a choice, but it’s okay to ask them
[00:39:19]
to make that choice because you need as
the boss to protect your business fair.
[00:39:24]
Is that helpful?
[00:39:25]
Yeah, absolutely.
[00:39:26]
We have to protect
the business and doing so.
[00:39:29]
Protect the other employees
and the other team.
[00:39:31]
Your clients, your opportunity
for helping others.
[00:39:34]
Yes.
You’ll make profit.
[00:39:35]
That’s not the only reason
you’re in business.
[00:39:38]
You’re in business to serve your clients
[00:39:40]
and your customers and help them get what
they need because they still need it.
[00:39:44]
Whether we deliver it or not,
[00:39:45]
you need to be there for them so
they can get what they want right?
[00:39:49]
There’s a lot going on behind the scenes,
and I know those big,
[00:39:52]
heavy moments can scare bosses, and that’s
why we’re always around for our clients.
[00:39:57]
It’s interesting when
you say scare bosses.
[00:40:00]
The main concern that I have is
that I’m not breaking some law.
[00:40:05]
Well, there are laws, so let’s be clear.
[00:40:07]
Don’t break them.
[00:40:10]
Don’t ask about whatever health, whatever.
[00:40:13]
Yeah.
[00:40:16]
Don’t ask them about their health.
[00:40:17]
But to my point, in my example,
[00:40:19]
it was your employee is sharing
with you that they have a life change.
[00:40:24]
And when they do that during that call,
when you’re doing your one to one
[00:40:29]
and they’re talking about their cat,
their cat is a family member.
[00:40:32]
James, that one that they were
upset about because they died.
[00:40:37]
You don’t have to agree
with their priorities.
[00:40:39]
You don’t have to have the same values.
[00:40:41]
But you do have to know that they have
a painful thing they’re going through.
[00:40:46]
And you have to decide
whether that’s worth it.
[00:40:48]
To you to keep this valued employee,
or if it’s the kind of thing that’s going
[00:40:52]
to interrupt your business so much
that you can’t offer anything outside
[00:40:56]
of compassion, understanding
and a choice for them.
[00:40:59]
Does that make sense?
[00:41:00]
Absolutely.
[00:41:03]
It takes me a lot of times.
[00:41:06]
It’s just a challenge, just like trying
to slow yourself down in communication.
[00:41:11]
You’re trying to consciously like, oh,
[00:41:14]
what would a compassionate person
with empathy say about this tap?
[00:41:19]
I have to think
[00:41:22]
lower person talk.
[00:41:24]
So here’s something.
[00:41:25]
And I’m going to be shocked if you
don’t actually have the same issue.
[00:41:29]
All of my emails start
with do the thing, James.
[00:41:33]
Do the thing.
Do it now.
[00:41:35]
Do it yesterday.
Like we talked about do the thing.
[00:41:37]
And then I stopped and I go back and I go,
James, How’s your day going, man?
[00:41:45]
I’m so sorry about your cat.
[00:41:46]
I hope he feels better.
Exclamation Mark,
[00:41:48]
exclamation Mark excellence,
and I go to the end and I throw in this
[00:41:51]
and that, and then I’m like, okay,
man, let me know what you need.
[00:41:54]
I’m here for you, right?
[00:41:55]
Or whatever I need to say.
[00:41:56]
But I am that communicator.
[00:42:01]
My brain is.
[00:42:03]
I’ve already quickly
identified what we need to do.
[00:42:06]
I’ve already identified that we
haven’t done what we need to do.
[00:42:09]
I’ve already identified that.
[00:42:10]
I’m disappointed that it’s not done,
[00:42:12]
but I’ve got to just write
out to do the thing.
[00:42:15]
And then every email I have to go,
[00:42:19]
and then I go back and I put in,
I guarantee you people that know me
[00:42:24]
that have worked with me are surprised
that that’s the way my emails go.
[00:42:27]
Maybe not all the people,
[00:42:30]
most of my clients, for sure,
[00:42:31]
they think of me as this compassionate,
understanding person, which I am.
[00:42:35]
But in my business, my first
thought is do the Dang thing.
[00:42:38]
Why are we talking about this, right?
Yes.
[00:42:40]
So I write that out,
[00:42:41]
and then I go back and I that’s your
moment where you’re thinking about it.
[00:42:46]
I totally understand that.
[00:42:47]
And I think a lot of people would
like to think my business has a need.
[00:42:51]
It needs the thing to be done.
[00:42:53]
Why is it the thing done right?
It’s okay.
[00:42:57]
Don’t give yourself a break.
It’s not a big adding that sugar coating.
[00:43:01]
I hate that.
[00:43:02]
No. What’s so painful about it? What’s so
[00:43:05]
painful about it? And why is it sugar
coating to be nice and civil to the people
[00:43:09]
that are serving you and your business and
your clients? Why is that sugar coating?
[00:43:14]
I always think of the stand up comic. I
[00:43:16]
can’t think who it was,
but they’re just like,
[00:43:17]
you ever hate it when somebody answers
honestly to the question, How’s it going?
[00:43:22]
You’re like, I didn’t really
want to know the answer.
[00:43:27]
I could be wrong, but I know
the date you’re talking about.
[00:43:30]
I love comedians, too.
Yeah.
[00:43:32]
How’s it going?
It’s great.
[00:43:33]
I know it’s good.
And here’s the thing.
[00:43:37]
The more you put that stuff in there,
[00:43:38]
the more you actually do put
the niceties in there, the civility.
[00:43:43]
Let’s dare to call it respect
for the human people.
[00:43:47]
I’m giving you a hard time.
[00:43:48]
James, just because, no, it’s cool.
[00:43:51]
But if we put that in there, they hear
what they want to hear in those emails.
[00:43:55]
They hear the words that you say means
something different to them, right?
[00:43:59]
That’s communication.
[00:44:00]
Your intent is let’s get to do the thing.
[00:44:03]
Their meaning that they put into it is,
[00:44:06]
he cares about my cat, he cares about me,
he cares about my pain.
[00:44:10]
Then you guys can get
to an understanding that.
[00:44:13]
Yes, we’re working about.
[00:44:15]
And I want us to work together, and I want
us to care about each other’s things.
[00:44:18]
Now let’s talk about
doing the thing perfect.
[00:44:21]
I like it.
I don’t like it.
[00:44:23]
I’ll talk to you.
No, I know.
[00:44:25]
I’m telling you, man.
[00:44:27]
First of all, I don’t think
you’re as bad as you’re saying.
[00:44:29]
And second of all,
[00:44:31]
I would tell you that it just makes such
a shift if you can just take the time
[00:44:35]
and the meaning to really be
there for them, and it doesn’t.
[00:44:39]
And I know, I’m sure I read it.
[00:44:42]
You’ve been in business so long.
[00:44:43]
You’ve got such a great team.
[00:44:44]
You are there if one of them came
in because a devastating thing happened,
[00:44:48]
I don’t believe for a second you’d be
like, but you’re not doing the thing.
[00:44:51]
So I get the no.
[00:44:53]
I more just solve the problem.
Yeah.
[00:44:56]
I’ve helped employees with busted
[00:44:59]
radiators where I just
replaced stuff on their car.
[00:45:02]
Yeah.
Solve the problem.
[00:45:04]
Solved the problem.
[00:45:05]
A lot of times I’ve had employees that are
[00:45:08]
super cool, but they just get
stuck in a trap of, oh, my gosh.
[00:45:12]
We got this problem, and I’m just like,
problems are meant to be solved.
[00:45:16]
It solves the problem.
We want their lives,
[00:45:18]
and they’re just like, oh, but can we
stare at the problem a little longer?
[00:45:22]
And I’m like, no staring.
[00:45:23]
We’re fixing you’re, my man.
[00:45:25]
That’s totally how we
roll here at boss action.
[00:45:27]
So I get that 100%
progression moving forward.
[00:45:30]
We can learn from our mistake, but that
should be a finite amount of time.
[00:45:34]
We can’t live in that mistake, right?
No.
[00:45:37]
Learn from it.
Resolve.
[00:45:38]
Move forward.
I agree.
[00:45:39]
I want to ask you about something.
[00:45:41]
As far as shifting gears in regards
to entrepreneurship, bring it.
[00:45:47]
Typically, I won’t say every
typically many entrepreneurs.
[00:45:51]
The goal is you start your business,
[00:45:52]
you build your business,
and then you either sell your business or
[00:45:56]
you build your business to the point
that you’re not needed anymore.
[00:45:58]
That is correct.
All these things are possible.
[00:46:00]
Now let’s just take that fork in the road
where it’s like, I’m not selling,
[00:46:04]
but I don’t want to necessarily
be needed in my business anymore.
[00:46:08]
How do I.
[00:46:11]
That’S what we should all be doing.
[00:46:12]
We should all be just like.
[00:46:13]
You’D be surprised how many entrepreneurs
don’t seem to be headed down that road.
[00:46:19]
All you got to ask them is, do you
have the people you trust around you?
[00:46:22]
They’re going to say, no, I don’t.
That’s why I have to be there.
[00:46:24]
And then you say, Let me
introduce you to boss actions.
[00:46:27]
So interesting story.
[00:46:29]
Just side tangent here.
[00:46:32]
We have answered the phones for clients.
[00:46:34]
I believe that they were the only one
that could do what they could do.
[00:46:38]
The customers, I can talk
to a garage door opener guy.
[00:46:40]
We answered the phones for him.
[00:46:42]
Super cool guy, but he’s moving.
[00:46:45]
So I’m like, hey, why don’t we
just take calls for your grunt?
[00:46:47]
You still have clients?
Yeah.
[00:46:49]
You could send it over
to one of your competitors.
[00:46:51]
They give you a little nut.
[00:46:52]
You make money in your sleep,
and he’s like, oh,
[00:46:55]
when my callers call, they want me
to go out there to fix a garage door.
[00:47:01]
What the hell they do?
[00:47:05]
If you got hit by a bus, it would be like,
no more fixed garage doors ever.
[00:47:09]
Yeah.
[00:47:11]
And I will tell you that that was
a big part of what we do, right?
[00:47:16]
I think that that’s a sweet spot for us is
working with the person who thinks that.
[00:47:21]
I know there’s more.
[00:47:22]
I know I could do more clients if
I could just get myself out of it.
[00:47:25]
But I can’t imagine how I could get myself
[00:47:27]
out of it because I’m the only
one who cares enough can do it.
[00:47:32]
Whatever.
[00:47:33]
And so that shift, we remind them that’s
[00:47:36]
the shift from moving from an overwhelmed
business owner to a thriving boss.
[00:47:46]
I really believe in my heart of hearts.
[00:47:48]
Every business can be scaled,
and it is 190,000%.
[00:47:53]
That’s not math.
But you get my point.
[00:47:55]
I do on the team that you develop,
[00:47:58]
you can build a whole business,
step back as the CEO,
[00:48:03]
bring on a new CEO and just be
a chairman of the board or the owner.
[00:48:07]
You don’t actually have to be in there.
[00:48:09]
But you would have to know how
[00:48:11]
to identify, attract
and really get in there.
[00:48:14]
The kind of CEO that will rock
the business to give you the results
[00:48:17]
you’re looking for,
you have to learn how to do that.
[00:48:21]
And that’s about building
a team you trust.
[00:48:22]
I’m telling you that’s all that it is.
[00:48:24]
If you are honest with yourself today,
if there’s somebody that you’re having
[00:48:28]
a problem with,
it’s because you’ve lost trust.
[00:48:30]
So now we have to learn how to attract
[00:48:32]
the kind of people that you can trust
for whatever role we’re trying.
[00:48:35]
Now, there’s more to it.
Sometimes
[00:48:38]
if it’s okay, I don’t
know where at the time.
[00:48:40]
Sorry, but we call it Frankensteining.
A role.
[00:48:44]
Right.
[00:48:45]
So let’s imagine I’m building a new role.
We’re scaling.
[00:48:48]
When you scale, you have
to create new types of positions.
[00:48:50]
And so I’m like, okay,
[00:48:52]
I need somebody in my marketing company,
and I start with my list of what I want.
[00:48:56]
And so I want them to handle my editorial
calendar for posting social media.
[00:49:00]
And I want them to create beautiful Canva,
[00:49:05]
which is a software
branding specific imagery.
[00:49:09]
And I want them to write my content
and post so that it looks amazing.
[00:49:13]
And I’m going to ask them to do some
[00:49:15]
receipts because I don’t think
that will keep him busy enough.
[00:49:17]
So I’m just going
to Frankenstein this role.
[00:49:19]
I’m going to put everything
in the kitchen sink in there.
[00:49:22]
And what that means is you are guaranteed
to never have a fully successful person
[00:49:28]
because you will only ever
see the thing they don’t do.
[00:49:31]
And the creative mind that is creating
beautiful imagery and gets the branding.
[00:49:36]
And the person who’s going to be hugely
[00:49:37]
successful at that has no chance of being
successful at getting those receipts.
[00:49:42]
Right.
And the person who’s great at content
[00:49:45]
writing is highly unlikely to be able
to be the person that is great
[00:49:50]
at editorial calendars and deadlines
and making that kind of stuff happen.
[00:49:53]
Now, can you find somebody who’s great
[00:49:55]
at all those things
and every boss out there?
[00:49:58]
I hear you, you’re rolling
your eyes and saying, I do it.
[00:50:02]
No, you don’t.
[00:50:02]
First of all, you don’t do it as well
as you think all four of those things.
[00:50:06]
But the truth of the matter
is you also don’t want you.
[00:50:09]
If you hire a bunch of mini knees,
they’re going to go and do their own
[00:50:14]
thing, which means they’re never invested
in the role you’ve hired them for.
[00:50:17]
It just isn’t going to be true.
[00:50:19]
Don’t Frankenstein, learn to identify,
[00:50:22]
learn how to structure businesses,
business positions that you can attract
[00:50:27]
a type of person to be successful
in. Does that make sense?
[00:50:30]
Absolutely.
Hiring is about planning for success.
[00:50:33]
That’s all that we teach business owners
[00:50:35]
how to imagine what if
everything goes right?
[00:50:37]
And everybody says, yes, that means
we need more people successful.
[00:50:42]
You’re going to always be hiring.
[00:50:43]
And that’s a good thing, not a bad thing.
Yeah.
[00:50:46]
It’s interesting.
I didn’t realize this until now that you
[00:50:50]
and I are essentially
after the same client.
[00:50:53]
Probably tell me about your clients.
[00:50:55]
We’re essentially after business owners
[00:50:57]
that are interested in growing
their business 100%.
[00:51:00]
And
[00:51:02]
interesting,
[00:51:04]
we traditionally work with business owners
[00:51:07]
from, like, as far as revenues
500,000 up to 50 million.
[00:51:11]
But the real thing is the number
of people on the team.
[00:51:14]
Again, team independent contractors,
[00:51:18]
vendors and employees.
Right.
[00:51:20]
So it can be any shape in there.
[00:51:22]
But really, they usually have less
than 20 employees or 20 team members.
[00:51:27]
Right.
[00:51:28]
You might have a marketing consultant
that has six different independent
[00:51:33]
contractors because they are full service
agency, but they never really sat down
[00:51:37]
and got structured about how they’re going
to hire in the roles and stuff like that.
[00:51:41]
So that’s a client.
[00:51:43]
But they know that their business could be
[00:51:45]
so much more, so much bigger,
so much more profitable.
[00:51:49]
They just had the right team.
[00:51:53]
That’s the problem we solved, but very
much about growth, just like you.
[00:51:56]
Name a game.
I love it.
[00:51:57]
Tell me, where can people find you?
[00:52:00]
Thanks for asking.
[00:52:02]
You can find us at bossactions.com.
[00:52:05]
And we’re on all the face place,
Insta, Twitter, LinkedIn.
[00:52:11]
You can also find us as The Boss Actions
[00:52:14]
on those places because there was
a squatter on boss action.
[00:52:19]
The website is bossactions.com.
[00:52:22]
Everything else is The Boss Actions.
[00:52:24]
And I would love to connect
with anybody that has questions.
[00:52:27]
Make sure you let us know.
[00:52:29]
I know James can point you to me at any
[00:52:31]
time, but I’m really grateful
to be here with you, sir.
[00:52:34]
Yeah.
So final thing.
[00:52:36]
What is one step that you can think of
a business owner
[00:52:38]
that would be great for them to do
[00:52:40]
to start going down the road
of having a successful team?
[00:52:44]
Okay, so the first we dropped,
like all my favorite rules, right?
[00:52:49]
Stop hiring for potential.
No more of that.
[00:52:51]
That doesn’t help you give people a chance
[00:52:53]
by telling them immediately
what’s going on
[00:52:55]
the two big ones hiring, ones management.
[00:52:59]
But the thing I would tell you is you need
to be aware that you need to be ready.
[00:53:04]
Do it sooner than you’re ready.
[00:53:07]
You’re going to get more
and more overwhelmed.
[00:53:10]
And if you try to push it off and think
[00:53:12]
I’m going to hire it when I have so many
clients that I can easily pay for it and I
[00:53:17]
can do this,
you’re still going to have to take
[00:53:20]
the time to hire and you’re not
going to want to do it correctly.
[00:53:23]
So here’s my hint.
[00:53:25]
I want you to identify what your next hire
is, and if you need help with that,
[00:53:28]
you can find me, but identify
what your next hire is.
[00:53:31]
And I want you to take their salary or
monthly rate and break it down into it
[00:53:35]
because you might be hiring an independent
contractor vendor,
[00:53:38]
break it down into a monthly amount
that you would have to outlay right again,
[00:53:43]
if it’s salary, you’re not paying the
whole salary the first day, everybody.
[00:53:46]
So just a monthly amount.
[00:53:47]
And I want you to add that line
into your budget wherever it goes.
[00:53:51]
If you hit it for three months,
you start hiring immediately.
[00:53:55]
Now, you should be confident
that you can cover it right?
[00:53:59]
The other time is when you’ve got the big
[00:54:00]
contract and you’re
trending your sales up.
[00:54:03]
That’s when you should be hiring again.
[00:54:05]
Never let three months
in a row scaling business.
[00:54:08]
You should be hiring.
[00:54:11]
It’s only going to get more overwhelmed.
[00:54:13]
At what point of overwhelm will you take
[00:54:15]
action to start building a team
that you can depend on interest?
[00:54:19]
It’s going to start now.
[00:54:20]
That’s a great question.
[00:54:21]
I love that one.
Thank you.
[00:54:23]
That’s mine, at what point overwhelm?
[00:54:25]
Because that’s
what my clients feel usually.
[00:54:27]
They wait till they’re
so stressed out and overwhelmed.
[00:54:29]
The business is successful.
[00:54:30]
The clients are coming in,
but now they’re having to start to turn
[00:54:33]
things away because they don’t have a team
they fully trust where they can fully
[00:54:37]
deliver or just the right
people or enough people, right?
[00:54:39]
Yeah.
Overwhelmed.
[00:54:40]
That’s fair.
Interesting.
[00:54:42]
I think we were there in the first
seven years of business.
[00:54:44]
Well, that’s fantastic.
[00:54:46]
Not that you were overwhelmed, but that
you were able to scale and grow so fast.
[00:54:49]
Yeah.
It was just one of those where we were
[00:54:51]
just like, I’m embarrassed to offer what
we have for sale for sale on any great
[00:54:56]
scale because we’re still working
on our team kind of thing.
[00:55:00]
We just spend so much time on the team
[00:55:02]
instead of selling because we
got to mop up after the team.
[00:55:07]
And ideally, a business owner doesn’t get
[00:55:09]
fully out of the sales,
whether it’s the face or they’re doing
[00:55:12]
speaking or however,
the business model works.
[00:55:15]
I don’t think you can really step out
[00:55:17]
of sales fully until you’re
at least at 5 million in revenue.
[00:55:20]
That’s my impression,
what I’ve seen in small business.
[00:55:24]
So the more we can get space by
turning you more into that CEO of I manage
[00:55:30]
my team that manages the results,
and I’m out there in front of the people I
[00:55:34]
need to be in front of to make sure we’re
still getting the leads and the business
[00:55:37]
is doing that’s the ultimate
CEO that we want for everybody.
[00:55:41]
I like it awesome.
[00:55:42]
Talmar, thank you so much
for being on the show.
[00:55:45]
Thank you, James.
I really appreciate being here with you
[00:55:47]
and your audience and man,
I love that you’re out there helping them
[00:55:50]
because small business is just
the best thing out there.
[00:55:53]
It’s pretty awesome.
[00:55:54]
It’s pretty cool.
[00:55:56]
Can you tell us that
website one more time?
[00:55:58]
Absolutely.
bossactions.com.
[00:56:01]
That is not www.
[00:56:04]
Just bossactions.com.
[00:56:05]
bossactions.com
[00:56:06]
Easy, super simple.
[00:56:09]
You’ll find Talmar, awesome.
This has been
[00:56:11]
Authentic Business Adventures,
the business program that brings you
[00:56:15]
the struggles stories and triumphant successes of business owners across
[00:56:18]
the land we are underwritten
locally by the Bank of Sun Prairie.
[00:56:21]
If you’re listening to this on the web,
[00:56:22]
if you could do us a huge favor,
give us a thumbs up, subscribe,
[00:56:26]
and of course, share it with all your
entrepreneurial friends,
[00:56:29]
especially those that have employee
problems, which, let’s be honest, it’s all of them.
[00:56:36]
Employees are people.
What are you going to do?
[00:56:38]
I know, but that’s why people want to work
for you and they want to be successful.
[00:56:41]
We just as a boss,
[00:56:42]
we need to give them
the tools so they can do it.
[00:56:45]
There are steps we need to take.
[00:56:46]
That’s all there is to it.
[00:56:47]
My name is James Kademan
[00:56:49]
and Authentic Business Adventures is
brought to you by Calls on Call,
[00:56:52]
offering call answering and reception
of services for service businesses
[00:56:56]
across the country
on the web at callsoncall.com
[00:56:59]
As well as
[00:57:02]
Draw in Customers Business Coaching, offering business coaching services
[00:57:03]
for entrepreneurs looking
for growth on the web at drawincustomers.com
[00:57:07]
And of course,
The Bold Business Book, a book
[00:57:10]
for the entrepreneur in all of us
available wherever fine books are sold.
[00:57:13]
We’d like to thank you our wonderful
listeners as well as a guest.
[00:57:16]
Talmar Anderson,
[00:57:17]
the founder and CEO of Boss Actions
and it’s found at bossactions.com
[00:57:23]
Talmar, thank you so much
for being on the show.
[00:57:25]
Thank you so much, boss on everybody.
[00:57:28]
You can do this.
[00:57:29]
Absolutely past episodes can be found
[00:57:31]
morning, noon, and night.
Podcast link found at drawincustomers.com
[00:57:35]
Thank you for listening.
[00:57:35]
We’ll see you next week.
[00:57:37]
I want you to stay awesome.
And if you do nothing else,
[00:57:39]
enjoy your business.