How To Market a Coaching Business

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Tiago Faria – Coach Marketing Secrets

Podcast Overview:

00:00 Rejecting false marketing promises, advocating for authenticity.
04:49 11 sounds like Jurassic time; photos bad.
08:26 Started consulting smaller businesses, then added Facebook ads.
12:01 Transitioning from client acquisition to coaching.
15:59 Using paid experiments, podcast, YouTube, expertise.
18:46 Embracing authenticity led to attracting opportunities.
21:05 Inspiration, strategy, and value drive content creation.
23:27 Different stress at new workplace feels better.
28:04 Focus on urgent problems, avoid procrastination. Choose niche, interview potential clients.
29:57 Focus on solving specific problems for career transformation.
35:28 Offer fee for client referrals, leverage contacts.
38:41 Find the pain, help them remove it.
39:28 Assisted in local and international success stories.
42:51 Focus on urgent problem for quick wins.
46:41 Focus on specific clients for successful implementation.

Podcast Transcription:

Tiago [00:00:00]:
Fear of

Tiago [00:00:00]:
staying in this corporate game long term was already bigger than the fear of risking something on my own.

James [00:00:06]:
You have found Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumphant successes of business owners across the land. We are locally underwritten by the Bank of Sun Prairie.

Tiago [00:00:19]:
The if you’re listening or watching this on the

James [00:00:19]:
web and you wanna download some audio episodes, by all means, go to the podcast link found at drawincustomerscom. The Today, we’re welcoming slash preparing to learn from Thiago Faria, a business mentor for coaches and mentors with a unique and very interesting, I must say, the anti marketing approach. So, Tiago, how is it going today?

Tiago [00:00:40]:
Very good, my friend. I love your name because James in

Tiago [00:00:46]:
the In English, it’s actually the translation of my name, Tiago.

Tiago [00:00:47]:
Saint James, Santiago.

James [00:00:48]:
Really?

Tiago [00:00:49]:
So we are related. Yes. I saw it somewhere on on the webs. The I’m not don’t take me

Tiago [00:00:55]:
for a

Tiago [00:00:55]:
scientifical research, but, I think it is. Yeah.

James [00:00:57]:
Worldwide. All good. So let’s start with looking approach. That is, a bold statement, I guess, as far as that goes. So let’s jump down that rabbit hole right away.

Tiago [00:01:09]:
The Yeah. So it’s not anti marketing per se, of course. I’m a lover of marketing. It’s mostly anti, the And I like what what we’re bombarded daily by the gurus, Internet marketing gurus telling us, you know, that’s, there’s an easy button to the That you press and you you’re 1 funnel away from magic and, you just need to use this funnel tactics and this landing kademan this ads. The and and usually that’s a recipe for for disaster, especially if you’re in the beginning stages of your of your business, in my opinion. The because, you get you get kind of it’s it’s a trap. You get trapped in those kind of you try to find the fastest, more complex way to do to to start getting clients, for example. The And then you tried for a while.

Tiago [00:01:51]:
It doesn’t work immediately. So and then you quit very easily, and then you oh, there’s something even shinier on this side. So the And this is a game that I was I was personally stuck on for 2 to 3 years. And, yeah, it’s something that that’s not advisable because, the 1, it’s

Tiago [00:02:08]:
overly complex for someone

Tiago [00:02:08]:
who’s starting right now. And 2, you you kind of, the You are complicating your life too much, and you just keep jumping from strategy to strategy, and you never let yourself, grow to its to its fullest potential of any or one of those strategies. So it’s it’s it’s, it’s anti war that kind of marketing flashiness approach. The and why do I go against it? Because I suffered for for 2, 3 years. I worked at Google for 8 years. And then once once I quit the That, job I came back to Portugal tried to start my own business with those complex strategies and, hit against a brick wall. It was not working. I was making my life very tough.

Tiago [00:02:47]:
The My life and my client’s life very tough. So since then I’ve been trying to simplify my approach as much as possible. Okay. This is overly complex. Maybe we don’t need this. The the 1st step I took was to work finally with a mentor. After 3 years trying to break the stone on my own, the Trying to do everything on our own. We we always we always had this thought that we, yeah, we can do everything.

Tiago [00:03:10]:
We’re we’re superheroes. Right? We and we can do everything on our own, but no. It’s a big mistake. The So I worked with a mentor, created my plan, focused on a specific person I wanted to help, specific problem I wanted to help, and simplified my strategy inspired by the book of this the Gentlemen, you’re getting everything you can out of all you’ve got from the program. Nice. And I focused on this last sentence, all you’ve got. The And I was thinking, okay. What do I have, you know, in my world? I have a contact list of I have a network of people that I know, that I interact with.

Tiago [00:03:41]:
The I have relationships. Right? And I have, audience. Most of us already have some sort of audience on LinkedIn or Facebook, whatever. The And I was thinking of ways. Okay. How can I leverage my current assets to start a cool business that can, you know, grow sustainably until the 10 k level? The so the after that, we can start playing with more complex strategies. But until then, I believe it’s not necessary. I believe we have everything we need in our world the Right now to capture even high high ticket paying, dream clients.

Tiago [00:04:13]:
But of course, we need to tweak the way we position ourselves, the way we the Create an offer and the way then we, you know, offer it to to the people around us. But that’s the baseline of, of the strategy is, the we already have everything we need. We just need to tweak some things.

James [00:04:29]:
Alright. You went through a lot of stuff there. Let’s start with the Google one. The you have the job with Google for a while. 8 years seems

Tiago [00:04:36]:
It is.

James [00:04:37]:
I’m guessing. I don’t know for sure because I don’t have anything to support either way, but the But I’m guessing that that’s a long time. It’s a place like Google.

Tiago [00:04:45]:
Yes. Yes. It’s, ages. Like a Ages.

James [00:04:48]:
11. James.

Tiago [00:04:49]:
The Doesn’t lie 11 sounds like a Jurassic period of of time. I I look back to the photos I took then, and the the phones were horrible, and the I didn’t have half of the things that we own today. But, yeah, it was it was a long time. I for 5 for 5 years, I was enjoying it, the game. The but after 5 years, I started feeling, oh, something is wrong here. It’s I’m I’m I’m a bit misplaced. The At first, I thought you’re walking me down the wrong role or maybe on the wrong office. Everyone is moving offices in Google, going to New York or into Chicago or going to to Malaysia.

Tiago [00:05:24]:
So maybe that was an issue, but, I wasn’t able to to even change roles because I was not super motivated. I would go to those interviews and, like, yeah, I’m good at the Yes. And then if I wanted to do that, but, you know, I wasn’t bringing my true self to those interviews, so I wasn’t able even to move inside. The So, I slowly started realizing maybe the problem is is me. I’m in the wrong place. I’m in the wrong area, you know. I’m and, the Slowly started, Nesenia. I’m I’m psychologically unemployable.

Tiago [00:05:54]:
I I I was super annoyed of having a manager, nagging minor, every week. The So how was your OKRs? How are you? I was got got tired of of also not being not using my full creativity. I was, the You know, limited to Google Ads, you know, to work with these big shark companies, that are are my mostly my creativity was quite limited. The I didn’t like working for others. I did not unlike the feed away, the way that I was just feeding the big corporations. And I felt the need. Okay. I need to do something on my own.

Tiago [00:06:26]:
The And, yeah. And I slowly started thinking of ways to to start doing it. I started, like most of us did, like, creating some preppy drop shipping businesses the Here and there or, just to put the foot in the in the water. And then I decided, okay. I need to to get out of here because the fear of the Staying in this corporate game long term was already bigger than the fear of risking something on my own. When that happened, I talked to my wife. Okay. We need to get out here, the Go back to Portugal.

Tiago [00:06:54]:
I started preparing, you know, the the path. I invested here in some real estate. I also the Made sure that I already have a couple of clients, to work with when I once I came here. So and then I jumped in 2019. The but, yeah, of course, working at Google was super fun, of course, for long periods. Work hard, play hard. Of course, I knew, the Got to know amazing people that work there. Some of the biggest companies in the world I interacted with in in Europe and Middle East.

Tiago [00:07:24]:
The Yeah. Learned a bunch. It’s working at Cook was like the pinnacle of, if you would like to play the game, the corporate game, and you like the tech tech world and the online digital space, it’s it’s like amazing. The but you would you just I realized it just wasn’t for me.

James [00:07:38]:
Fair. Totally fair. I love that phrase you used, the psychologically unemployable. Because I feel like a lot of people, myself included, listening to this podcast could say, like, that’s what I am. The That’s what I am.

Tiago [00:07:53]:
Actually, first of all, I was initially. So

James [00:07:56]:
I mean, you got this corporate job working for a big the mega corporation probably making some decent money, having an okay time, but there came a time when you realized, I don’t wanna live my life this way.

Tiago [00:08:09]:
The I don’t wanna be on

James [00:08:09]:
my deathbed saying, I wish I did this, that, or the other thing, and eventually, the fear of Mhmm. What could have been the overcame. So that’s awesome. That’s very cool. So how did you decide not to get into some drop shipping business and do what you’re doing now?

Tiago [00:08:26]:
The Yeah. I actually didn’t didn’t start doing immediately what I’m doing now. I started, consulting smaller businesses in, like, using what I I knew before, like, the Google My Business, the for local businesses, some Google Ads. But slowly, I I started also immediately doing Facebook ads because I I I missed the The the the huge growth that Facebook ads were having while working at Google. I was like, I’m missing out on all of this fun stuff. So I immediately started, well, playing around with Google, Facebook ad as well. The but, yeah. I didn’t like the idea of having multiple bosses.

Tiago [00:08:59]:
So instead of having 1 boss, now I had multiple bosses, the Which was slow, you know, working as an agency for small local businesses. I I I fast realized also that was not my path. So I I the To quit a job, get to get another job. No. It doesn’t make sense. And so I thought, okay, who can I help the best? Who who who am I willing to work with that, the Well, I will enjoy. I could call it a real good transformation. And it will be something like who? Someone like myself.

Tiago [00:09:26]:
I was helping others achieve results. The So that’s exactly who I should be focused on, helping, people in this kind of help industry, which are coaches, consultants, service providers that focus on the Generating, like, amazing transformations that are that you can, charge high ticket for. So basically, that’s my area of expertise the What I decided to focus more on. That’s that’s where I felt more comfortable and where I could generate the biggest results. And that’s exactly how I the Okay. This is my my, my beach. Like we say in Portugal, this is

James [00:10:00]:
my beach. Gotcha. Alright. So when you first left and the and you start your own thing. You have all these bosses by bosses. You’re talking about their clients, and they’re just smaller clients. And a lot of times, the smaller clients are the the naggiest kind of clients.

Tiago [00:10:14]:
What’s demanding, naggiest. Yes. Yes.

James [00:10:16]:
Yeah. Or they they don’t even know what to ask for, or they didn’t

Tiago [00:10:19]:
even know what to ask for. Of your work wasn’t the the time.

James [00:10:22]:
Sure. They don’t know what success necessarily looks like, I imagine. I’m guilty of this as well when I’ve paid marketers to help me out. The In the end, I just want the investment in marketing to turn into cash Yep. By way of adding more clients. And

Tiago [00:10:42]:
the and I feel like a lot of times with

James [00:10:42]:
marketers versus business owners of whatever business, there’s, somewhat of a disconnect of an expectation the versus reality, and maybe neither one necessarily knows. There’s I guess my point there is there’s no hard and fast. Like, hey. If you invest, whatever, the $100, $1,000, whatever it is, you will get why. Because then if that why was bigger, everyone would be like, yes. The I’ll make that trade all day long multiple times if I can. So you were kinda getting annoyed by that, I imagine. You’re like, this isn’t any good.

James [00:11:15]:
The So how did you pivot to the point of targeting the high ticket coaches and stuff like that?

Tiago [00:11:21]:
Because I I I felt that in order to make a big difference in any company, the I will need to be involved not only in the marketing per se, but also in the creation of what what they have to offer. Right? And, I guess we can. The Yeah. Expands. Kind of a little advanced, but, because you’re basically, if you if we’re running ads to something, you’re the And that offer that that person has or the company has is nothing, you know, that is proven to work or it’s not really well created. The You’re just pouring a pile of of gas in a pile of sticks. Right? And if there’s no combustion, there’s not gonna be any any any fire, any explosion, or whatever. The so I I was I was feeling like that.

Tiago [00:12:01]:
I was, bringing clients or bringing eyes eyeballs into, companies, but then the service was not amazing or the what What they had to offer was just exactly the same as multiple other companies around that we did the same. So I felt okay. I need to be more involved in the Both the offer of what, the offer creation and then putting all the marketing efforts on top. Because then I can control it at that aspect and it’s it’s more likely that we’ll the Will generate results. And I was not an expert in any of those areas where I was go I was helping dentists, you know, I was helping, lawyers, you know, local businesses. The So I figured, okay, help someone that I understand like myself. I’m a consultant. I’m a I’m a coach.

Tiago [00:12:44]:
I’m a business mentor. The So, yeah. And that, in that case, I can more easily impact on what they have to offer. Cause I I it’s easier to create an offer, the You know, out of

Tiago [00:12:56]:
your own knowledge, out

Tiago [00:12:56]:
of your expertise, and you can create it for, like, very quickly out of out of nothing versus forcing a dentist to create a completely new the Service or whatever. So so, yeah, the in that sense, it helped me out. It made it makes my life easier to help the To to bring results. And it’s also very good for for my clients because I help them okay. Let’s use whatever you have, your knowledge, your expertise, and, etcetera to the And your clients to create something that people actually would want to buy desperately. You know? And then the marketing is easy. After that, after you have something that people want badly, the offer

Tiago [00:13:30]:
the If they offer sales

Tiago [00:13:31]:
by by itself, any marketing and sales will work, even if you’re not terribly good at marketing or or sales. But if you have something that people really want, the Done. Everything’s much easier.

James [00:13:40]:
Alright. So it hasn’t been tough to find coaches and mentors that were willing to listen, I guess, for lack of a better phrase.

Tiago [00:13:51]:
No. Actually, no. No. It does. The People now what I think they’re understanding even more and more the need for that, because many many coaches now came. At least here in Portugal, it became very fashionable to be a be a coach. The and they all, like, took the same certifications, same same kind of, yeah, certifications that that they thought would be enough to you’re gonna start a whole business and grow crazy like that. But, most of them come to the market, and they see that, it’s really hard to differentiate nowadays because the If you just come to the market saying, I’m a coach.

Tiago [00:14:21]:
I’m a I know I’m I’m about to say a life coach. Very generic expression.

James [00:14:26]:
Yeah. Right?

Tiago [00:14:27]:
And then nowadays nowadays, it’s like, the Just okay. Cool. Good for you. Your life course it just comes to 1 on 1 year, goes out of the other, and it basically is just a bit of noise on the Internet. The so they feel the need in, to okay. How can I differentiate differentiate myself? And that’s how, you know, usually they look for help. The and, usually, either they find me and and then or someone else who will help them out. But but it’s it’s, the It’s it’s a need nowadays with with the market’s getting more and more competitive, especially in the US and North America.

Tiago [00:14:58]:
My god. But in Portugal, even also the james, which the This is the market I’ve been focused on mostly. But but, yeah, I think that’s the that’s the main issue.

James [00:15:08]:
Alright. The Yeah. It’s the word coach has been thrown around a lot, and it’s only ramped up because, I guess, the barrier to entry is you you have to have Internet and a computer or sometimes maybe even your phone. Right? And it’s interesting. I’ve the run into business coaches and all that jazz, life coaches, health coaches, insert descriptor here, and then coach. The is very interesting. Some are good, doing very well, and others well, some are not that good and still doing very well. The but it’s interesting how that term is just thrown onto anything.

James [00:15:46]:
So when you say that people came to you, were you doing any the paid marketing at all to attract them, or was it more something else? I don’t know. Magic in the sky, something like that.

Tiago [00:15:59]:
The No. I did some some paid, experiments while I was in that, shiny object chasing. The But but I the majority of of the people that found me were from my efforts I’ve done, at the beginning stages of my career here. I the I created a podcast. I actually started like you what you’re doing. I created a podcast, in order to great gain some authority quick quickly in my market. The and those episodes still today bring me, new leads. But also I also position myself as an expert on on the on YouTube and created my, the My own kind of monologue channel and monologue podcast.

Tiago [00:16:38]:
I’ve always felt that I was not a content creator, the But, I defeated that stupid belief by just brute force. I I did I did a 90 day challenge, 90 videos, 90 consecutive days on YouTube, the Which I extended later for a 120 just just because, yes, which helped me, yeah, beat the belief, position myself as a partner of YouTube, the and, you know, create a huge library of videos that cover many, many topics and, that are still searchable nowadays. And, the I think it was mostly the the creation of the content plus my podcast that has has been bringing me more more people, at least here in the local markets. The

James [00:17:17]:
That’s awesome. Yeah. She said 90 days, 90 videos, so a video a day. And they’re 90 seconds longer initially they were, the or tell

Tiago [00:17:28]:
me how

Tiago [00:17:28]:
long they were. No. No. No. This was normal YouTube videos. I would 10 minutes, 15, some sometimes 20. I was a

James [00:17:35]:
little And you’re doing 1

Tiago [00:17:36]:
a day?

Tiago [00:17:37]:
The Yes. For this

James [00:17:39]:
for the 90 days. Yeah. Holy cow. That’s that’s impressive to say the least just from an editing standpoint.

Tiago [00:17:45]:
The No. No. No. No. Of course. I would not I would kill myself. I would if I was playing also the game of editing. I was just, you know, the Press record.

Tiago [00:17:53]:
I have the by 3 topics. I put the paper next to me to so that not to forget. And I would just, the You know, just jam into camera to the camera and then just upload whatever it was. I wouldn’t think about it. Otherwise, I would the Go into the, okay. The perfectionism game. Right? And, no, I would never publish anything. I just keep going, keep going without looking backwards, the Improving my skills like crazy.

Tiago [00:18:17]:
Right? I was getting better and better. Of course, the first videos were horrible. But then, at some point, the Because you’re doing it every day and forcing yourself to, improve and, gain experience. By the 30th video, I was I I I found my voice. I was like, oh my god. The Now I know exactly who I’m talking to, the the person, his frustration, what he need to do, etcetera. And it it was felt through the camera. Many people said around that video that, like, the Now you’re now now you’re like, you’re you’re being yourself.

Tiago [00:18:46]:
I was I was I started becoming genuine and, and then the That’s starting to attract opportunities to my world. Yeah. Because before I was trying to force a bit myself. I was trying to be someone I wasn’t not exactly. I didn’t know who I was as a content creator, so I was just the Putting things out there. But at some point, I found my voice and, yeah, it was it was it’s perfect because you surpassed your all your the traumas and your all your fears of not being content creator. You gain a skill very quickly because you’re doing it every day. No matter what, no matter if you’re on holidays or if you’re sick or the There’s no excuse, and you’re accountable for because you’ve announced it, you know, on your 1st video and you told your friends, your your family, whatever.

Tiago [00:19:25]:
The and you position yourself as a content creator and YouTube likes it. Alright. This guy’s answering all the questions people have in this specific topic. I’m gonna put a bit more eyes eyeballs on him. The And then, yeah, after 90 days, you’re like you look back. Oh my god. I have this library of 90 amazing videos I can use and leverage for my clients, for my the leads, etcetera. And I will keep on bringing traffic because it’s it’s a search engine, YouTube.

Tiago [00:19:49]:
Right? People keep searching for those topics if you make the If you make them wisely, right, you have to think a bit about, search intent and SEO, you know, with all the cool keywords and, the but the simple act of being there present, daily, it really is a cool idea for for whoever is, like, the I need to create content thinking. I need to create content, but I I just don’t know how. I’m not good at it. Just do a 90 day challenge.

James [00:20:15]:
Just do it. That is to awesome. That’s 90 k seems like a long time to do anything that you’re not used to doing. Just in a row, regardless of what happens, how you’re feeling, what’s going on in the day, holiday, whatever, to is Yeah. Impressive. So you, with your experience at Google, did you know some of the the tricks, the, I guess, to to get found on YouTube because YouTube I don’t know what the number is for a number of videos that get uploaded every single day, but it’s gotta be in the neighborhood of the 1,000,000, if not billions

Tiago [00:20:44]:
Yes. Per second, though.

James [00:20:46]:
To be able to raise your hand through the noise and say, look at me. Right?

Tiago [00:20:53]:
The did you have

James [00:20:53]:
some idea or some skills in that regard?

Tiago [00:20:55]:
No. Because we didn’t touch organic while working there. So it’s all paid. Okay. It’s all the paid the diversion. So I learned it, like, through watching videos. Actually, through Miles Becker. He was my inspiration at the time.

Tiago [00:21:05]:
He was, he was the the crazy content creator that inspired me to start it. The but, yeah, it’s like, I knew that in order to get eyeballs in a new platform, I mean, you the You have to bring a lot of value, not only just random crap. Right? But actually, I was analyzing keywords, seeing what people like to people were searching for the Both on Google and YouTube. And then okay. I’ll just today, I’m gonna create a video around this specific keyword phrase. And, doing this, YouTube the Looks at you a bit like more as a content creator, like I said, and is looks at you as someone who’s answering all the questions people have. So, okay, let’s put some eyeballs on him. The Yeah.

Tiago [00:21:45]:
But it’s, it’s not an easy game to play. YouTube.

James [00:21:49]:
No. No.

Tiago [00:21:49]:
No. No.

James [00:21:50]:
No. I’ve had a much easier, the I don’t wanna say easier. I’ve had much more success with the audio side of the podcast, I guess, on our end with Authentic Business Adventures the than we have on YouTube. And I don’t just because of scale not scale. Just because, I guess, it’s designed to more for audio than for video. Perhaps, but I figured YouTube is such a big player in the the Internet, regardless of what you’re looking for, that we must be on there. So it’s interesting how some videos are going crazy cool, and others, you’re like, oh, the 6 views. That’s great.

Tiago [00:22:29]:
Yeah. YouTube is more for people, like, looking for quick, the Quick quick video consumption or, like, are looking for something some quick answer, right, versus podcast listeners are pretty below. They the Wanna sit sit down, listen tentatively, you know, their Yeah. And the Yeah. You know? And they’re usually podcasters are usually podcast listeners. I’ve seen studies that are that the I have higher value purchase as well, so it’s really great audience.

James [00:22:56]:
Oh, interesting. Well, we’d like to think we’re smarter. Right? The anyway, so business is going well, it sounds like. Is that fair to say?

Tiago [00:23:09]:
The Well, it’s not exactly what I want already, but, I

James [00:23:11]:
think always want the problems. Right? I mean, no one’s ever gonna be like, yep. I’m cool right here. The I don’t that’s probably not even realistic if you do believe that.

Tiago [00:23:19]:
I think it’ll be

Tiago [00:23:20]:
But I

Tiago [00:23:20]:
guess You’re right.

James [00:23:21]:
You’re happy you made the change. Is that safe to say from

Tiago [00:23:24]:
Yes. Yes.

James [00:23:25]:
Leaving the corporate gig? The

Tiago [00:23:27]:
For sure. For sure. It’s like Alright. Completely different, you know, I don’t know, different vibe, different, the even when things don’t go well, I mean, I never feel as stressed out as when I was at Google for, like, having meetings with my boss or the This stupid presentation I didn’t wanna deliver. It’s a different kind of stress. You know? You feel that you’re more in control. The And this this accountability, bring brings you more peace because you can control everything, but it’s you know? For the good, different than that. But, it feels better.

James [00:23:59]:
The So tell me a story about you when you were at Google. Were you married when you’re at Google?

Tiago [00:24:06]:
The Yeah. Yeah. I was, married 2016. So Okay. 3 or 4 years there, you know, before coming

Tiago [00:24:14]:
So the you pull your wife

James [00:24:17]:
aside, and you’re like, hey, honey. Funny story. I’m gonna leave my corporate gig and go off on my own, be the entrepreneur that I’ve always wanted to be.

Tiago [00:24:25]:
The how does she react?

Tiago [00:24:25]:
Yeah. Thank god she was completely understandable and and adventurous in that sense. The She she saw it. Oh, she was already seeing that I was miserable. You know, already become miserable there. Although she would love to keep saying to her friends and family, oh, my my the My husband works at Google. She she went and defeated that thought and, and she knew she knew that I really wanted this to to start something on my own. The Benjie also wanted to to come to Portugal.

Tiago [00:24:53]:
Portugal is an amazing country. It’s much more sunny than, Dublin, Ireland. Dublin is always rainy, very gray. The In the winters, you go to work. At night, you come back at night. It’s like, oh my gosh. So so she didn’t see it with bad eyes. The See.

Tiago [00:25:07]:
She just said, let’s go. Let’s do it. Whatever you what do you feel like is right? But, of course, we prepare we prepare our land. Right? We, the Yeah. Invested here in some real estate before we made the jump. And, yeah. And I prepared to make sure that a couple of clients align so that we can start from scratch from nothing. The but, yeah, she was super supportive and, but I think if she wasn’t, maybe I would not be able to do the jump or I don’t know.

Tiago [00:25:31]:
I would lose my the My faith of it was like, yeah. I’m just ready. It’s time to go. I don’t know. I think it was, was super important to her her help.

James [00:25:39]:
Sure. That’s fair. That’s totally fair. The so when you when a high end coach or high ticket coach comes to you, what is the first thing that you look at the in regards to what they have. Is it their offer? Is it how they are as a coach? Is it the marketing they’ve been doing and whether it’s worked or not? The what are you looking at when you dig under under the cover, so to speak?

Tiago [00:26:00]:
Yeah. I think you’re right. The first thing you said is is exactly the offer that I that I look at the Because that that’s exactly the way you position yourself is is the main issue for most cases. Like what you’re talk we talked about at the beginning that the niche, the the being a very generic. I’m just a live the Usually, that’s the main mistake, because we have this natural tendency of coming to market and we wanna help everybody. Everyone who gives us money is the Welcome.

James [00:26:25]:
Yeah. Yeah. Right?

Tiago [00:26:26]:
But that’s, that’s an, it’s a trap. It’s a trap. And, it’s sometimes at the beginning, it’s hard for people to to grasp it, the That idea. But I usually use this, metaphor, which is like, I have a river right here in front of me. It’s like Tagos River. And most of us, we want to capture all the fish in the swaver. So we use a huge fishnet. We pop pop it to the water, but that fishnet has huge holes between them and all the fish.

Tiago [00:26:50]:
Most of the fish go through it and you the And I’ve just kept catching a couple of them almost accidentally. Right? That’s that’s just what it needs to be a generic coach versus trying to capture don’t know how to say in English, a group of fish of the same of the fish. Cool.

James [00:27:04]:
Yeah. It’s

Tiago [00:27:04]:
cool. Exactly. Versus trying to create drive is cool and you have a smaller fish net with smaller holes and you the Are you able to capture all of them? Right? So that’s that’s the difference of of you position yourself as a a specialist. You know? I am I’m the I’m not a life coach. Oh, no. I’m not a relationship coach. I’m for example, I I help men that are on the verge of the horse to save their marriages, for example. The Something more tangible, more specific, and it resonates more with that group of people.

Tiago [00:27:31]:
Right? When someone here when a man that is in the situation hears that, he’s like, oh my god. The This is for me. Right? I need I need to just help me. I’m like, this is I have a desperate problem right now that I need to fix, exactly now. And he the He seems to be the only guy that understands me deeply. So it immediately transmit transforms into the only viable solution for my problem. Right? The So that’s the first thing is the niche, right, to to be very specific. And then also in terms of the offer, the other thing that the All of us at Ether to me do this mistake.

Tiago [00:28:04]:
Sorry. Is to, is not to be specific also on the on the problem and the Try to solve try when we try, and we don’t focus on solving a now problem. So something that is urgent for the buyer to solve right now. The If we solve some some problem that is okay. One day I’ll I’ll figure think about that. They will never buy. Right? We’ll just keep the Procrastinating and, one day I’ll invest in that. So we need to think of, all the problems we solved in before with our clients, all or the Or even interview people like I do in my entire marketing method is what it’s what I say is that you should first choose your niche and then talk to 5 to 10 the potential clients in that area that you feel that are related to your niche.

Tiago [00:28:49]:
And just ask some questions like, what are your main frustration? What are your main obstacles? What the What have you been struggling with? How does it feel like? What are your main objectives? And then figure out if there’s any pattern and realize what is the the urgent problem that you want to solve right now. And that will be your 1st offer. Your your your first high ticket offer should be around the An urgent now problem that they want badly to solve at this exact moment, not sometime in the future, has to be something that they wanna solve now.

James [00:29:18]:
The Can you give an example of a less than great offer that a client came to you and they were having, the and you tweaked it. I mean, sometimes it doesn’t take that much of a tweak and turn it into an actual offer that was producing for them.

Tiago [00:29:34]:
The

Tiago [00:29:35]:
Yeah. For example, the, my I have a a career coach. She’s called Lourdes, and she was up excuse me. I have some cough left today. The She was positioned herself like a generic, yeah, career coach. And then what we did to exercise with her, exactly this. So ask her questions about okay. Think about all the people you’ve worked in the past, the and make give give me a list of all the symptoms that it they brought to you.

Tiago [00:29:57]:
Now what were the original problems? What did you actually wanna solve in that precise moment? And then, simply the Make it made her think what was the problem that give you the most pleasure to solve and that you were able to generate a bigger transformation, like, more, the You know, the incredible transformation for the person. And then why don’t we just focus on that for this specific offer that we’re trying to work with her. The And, and yeah. And she she instead of being a career coach, she focused on, okay, I’ll focus on c levels that are willing to, the make a a complete career move, like, to different a different, area. Not not even within the company, but to a completely different different, the Area area of of, of expertise. You know? So once you focused on that, okay, it was much easier to find those people, to communicate to those people, the and to to to close the group, like, exactly. Like, I need 5 people that are willing to generate this, transformation to get this transformation. The so that that was the case.

Tiago [00:30:57]:
So instead of being generic career coach, no. I’m focusing on c levels that want to change completely their, career. No. The

James [00:31:05]:
Nice. And then digging deeper into the message itself, are you offering or are you suggesting that they offer something as basic as a free session or something like that? Or

Tiago [00:31:17]:
the what is the,

James [00:31:17]:
what is the call to action that you’re using as a trigger?

Tiago [00:31:22]:
I I usually like to, to the Recommend to my clients that they, they have free calls with their with their customers. Like, have a discovery calls because in my opinion, that’s the easiest way for you to the Close the client if you don’t have amazing copywriting skills. Right? You’re not you’re not a master copywriter. You cannot sell high ticket on a landing page if you don’t the Have those skills or if you don’t hire someone very expensive to do it for you. Right? And the second best way to do it is to, you know, start talking to people. It’s much easier for you to interview someone. And the And if you do it the right way, which is using the consultative sales, asking questions like, try to uncover the problems that person has. The make make that the person almost tell itself to you, through those questions.

Tiago [00:32:07]:
How does it make you feel? What have you tried before? What are your main goals? The and then simply at the end of the call, you simply ask the the question of, do you want help with that? And then selling doesn’t have to be more complicated than that. Just uncovering the The problem, make the person tell her her life story and what she wants to accomplish, and then simply ask if she wants help. And usually, the It’s easier for you to sell something that way because you contextualize what you’re gonna present to the person, and then she will see it as the logical next step to working with you because you’ve been spending time to Trying to understand what she’s going through. So, yeah, I I usually advise to be at a through a a sales call. The Gotcha. But that’s different ways to bring the persons to that call. Yeah?

James [00:32:50]:
Okay. So do everything you can to get that potential client the the call or set an appointment with the coach to see if there’s so the coach and the client can have a conversation

Tiago [00:33:00]:
Yeah. See if

James [00:33:01]:
they’re a good fit. And from there, the the coach will discover the pain and then focus on the pain and then make sure that they can solve that pain. So then it’s a easy layup at that point. The so I like it. What have been some of the marketing or, I guess, at this point, it’d be advertising channels that have worked the best for your coaching clients.

Tiago [00:33:22]:
The I actually don’t use advertisement, my client.

James [00:33:25]:
Do not? The anti marketing. Do not. Okay.

Tiago [00:33:27]:
The the goal of the anti marketing method is or you’re not to need that any of that because I said at the beginning, like, you already have everything you need in your world. You have a network of people. You have contact lists of previous clients, leads, etcetera. And you have your own the follower list. Right? Like, your audience. And the way I like to work with people in a sense is to start off with, okay, let’s let’s talk to your the Current and past clients, your leads, maybe even your audience to interview them. Make a, like a you can post something on on social media. Like, the I want to create a program around this topic to generate a specific, transformation.

Tiago [00:34:04]:
And I would love to have your the opinion. Like, would you be available for a 10 minute 10, 15 minute call? I’m just looking to have a feedback, from your side. And that’s a very easy yes that you get from most people that the that are that you have kind of a relationship with, either a contact or following on social media. With that, you already get many wins. Once you interview those 5 to 10 people, the They first of all tell you exactly what you have to create. Right? They will tell you what are the main problems, whether it be suffering, frustrations. The word the emotional words will be the Weapons that you can use in your own offer. So you can go back to the drawing board.

Tiago [00:34:38]:
Okay. People want to solve this urgent problem. I’m gonna create something around this. The They want to achieve this specific goal. This is gonna be my promise. So you create an offer around that. And then you can go back to all those people you just introduced, the And you say, hey. I just created this that solves, actually, the problem that you told me you had.

Tiago [00:34:54]:
What do you think of it? What’s your opinion? And, well, just with that, you already can have some 3 to 5 the Clients out of nothing because they already know you. They told you their life story. You created something around the problem they have, and the Most likely they will

Tiago [00:35:09]:
be interested in it.

Tiago [00:35:09]:
And, and if they’re not, you you also have you have an if they don’t need exactly what you offered, the You can you still have an opportunity there. Alright? You you can still ask those people. Okay. But do you know anyone else that would be interested in this offer or that we could benefit of this offer? Because

Tiago [00:35:27]:
the Because I have this referral program where

Tiago [00:35:28]:
I give you a fee for every client that you bring on my side. So leveraging referrals. Right? Proactively doing that the And systematically doing that to all your contacts around you, both for the people that need your offer right now that could become clients and for those that don’t need your offer the Because they’re not your target audience or whatever, but you can still leverage everything you have around you to create your sales team, and that will be incentivized to send you, the Very good leads and warm leads because you as you know, recommended and referred leads are easy to see, easier to sell. They’re they’re super motivated. The Right. Exactly. So that that’s basically the, entire marketing method is leveraging what you have to give your new offer to whoever needs it the Or just whoever doesn’t need it, you can ask them for, referrals.

James [00:36:14]:
Alright. So using what you have is the main idea the that you’ll initially send an email or something like that to your to your contact list or your LinkedIn contacts or something like that? Or the Yeah. Tell me about the initial communication with this, with your the contacts that you have.

Tiago [00:36:31]:
Yeah. So on social media, you can create a post.

Tiago [00:36:35]:
The Just saying what I said at the beginning.

Tiago [00:36:35]:
I’m creating a software on this, and I would love to have your opinion. Would you have 10, 15 minutes for a quick the Zoom call. And I recommend you you record it because then you can, you know, take those emotional words word by word that people say and and not just your the reputation. So that’s on social media. But then you can also reach out to your previous clients’ leads personally or send a message saying exactly the same thing. Hey. I wanna create an offer around this the Topic. Would you be available for 10 minutes to put you in a call? I would love to have your opinion.

Tiago [00:37:03]:
People love to give opinions, right, to give their feedback on something. Right? So it’s an easy yes. Usually, the You can easily get 10 people to to have an interview with Mhmm. Which can be very productive. And then and then then the interview, just ask what are your main frustrations, the problems. How does it make you feel? You try to really touch the wound and make people give you the most emotional answers and not just, the So let’s just say yes or no. Right? Do we touch digging deep deeper, like, how does it make you feel? But how does it look like during the day? And And once you collect all that information, it’s it’s amazing. You know, you you either notice a pattern in in terms of the the main problems and objectives, or you identify something that, okay, this the This is exactly what I wear I wanna work with.

Tiago [00:37:46]:
I wanna work with these specific people, and then you can use those words in your own in your own offer the description. Like, the main urgent problem is the transformation. These are the main things that I tried to do before and it didn’t work, the the objections. Right? The So just by interviewing people, you’re ready to get so much so much out of it. And, most of us avoid it stupidly. I don’t know why. The We have the tendency to be on our own minds, creating everything from from scratch, and then, okay. People want this for sure.

Tiago [00:38:16]:
I’m gonna put it in the market, the And nobody buys it.

James [00:38:19]:
For sure. Right? If you build it, they will come. Yeah. Yeah.

Tiago [00:38:24]:
I know it sounds like a a bit of boring work to the Talk to people and you wanna hide it behind your computer, but it it really does magic. It opens up so many doors. You know?

James [00:38:33]:
That’s it. Yeah. I wouldn’t the I guess I personally wouldn’t consider boring work because I love chatting with people, but

Tiago [00:38:38]:
that’s why

Tiago [00:38:39]:
I have

James [00:38:39]:
a podcast, I guess.

Tiago [00:38:40]:
Yes.

James [00:38:41]:
But it’s it’s interesting the that you’re talking about the the pain. What I learned in sales training that I’ve gone through is that you find the pain and, essentially, they call it twisting the knife. Or the or someone comes to you with a knife in their back and they’re kinda, I wanna get this knife under my back eventually that you you kinda wrench on the knife a little bit and you twist it the little bit, and you say, this knife, is this the one you wanna get out to the point where they feel like they must get it out, and you’re the one that’s the that’s right there to help them because you’ve gone through all the stuff and prove that you’re the person that helped them with the knife and all that kind of stuff, getting it out, the all that jazz. So it’s very interesting. Tell me tell me some of your success stories that you’ve had so far.

Tiago [00:39:28]:
The Yeah. So I I had more local, success stories done. My son, like, internationalization process right now. But, the but, yeah, one of the cases was the client that I’ve discussed before, Lourdes. So, yeah, I helped her create that specific proper program. The And she actually leveraged her own lists and contacts in her LinkedIn profile, etcetera. And she just created one of those posts that I actually recommend people to do the So hand raising posts, which are like it’s like you giving a, additional full of cookies and asking, oh, do you want one? The It’s it’s a very easy, it’s it’s a way to position an offer that is not selling directly. It’s just simply asking, do you want something? Do you want this? The and this kind of post is, like, I’m looking for 5 people that are, you know, inter that would like to obtain a specific goal.

Tiago [00:40:17]:
So if you are the this specific niche person, and you’re interested, just send me my email send me a message or comment below the word the Interesting. You know? And those specific posts, there are that’s how you can extract from your current social media the Those people that are ready to buy now and that are interested in, of course, in your new offer. You have to create something that they really wanna buy now. Right? If you don’t do that, it’s not not gonna work. The but with those posts, it’s it’s faster for you to identify those that are ready. And then it’s an excuse for you to interact with them. You can after that, you the You can send them a message. Right? Like a director or a messenger or whatever.

Tiago [00:40:57]:
And you you you start the process of selling it. Right? You the Can ask a couple of questions on on Messenger or through, message, to see if the person actually has a problem you could help solve, if they’re motivated to do it. The And if so, you just bring into a call, right, like we said before. And then, you know, it’s it’s it’s easier to sell to that person that showed already interest that I want I want in. The Yeah. And so so you do that, and she in a space of, a week and a half, she was able to close the 5 slots that she wanted to sell. The Wow.

Tiago [00:41:30]:
Each of

Tiago [00:41:30]:
them are €500, which is a great great amount of money here in Portugal. Yeah. And she was super happy, especially because she created a program that she didn’t have before the As a group program instead of 101. So she was able to okay. I’m just gonna create the videos and go on holidays. And when I’m back, I’ll also kick kick that program, the And I’ll just be present 1 hour per week, helping those 5 people and, you know, transporting them week by week until their main transformation. The And, yeah, she felt amazing with with it, all using what she had, you know, to create the offer and to sell it directly to those to the people that she

James [00:42:04]:
That’s awesome.

Tiago [00:42:05]:
The world.

James [00:42:06]:
The Yeah. That’s really impressive. Really impressive. What are some of the things what are some of the biggest mistakes that you see coaches making in regards to their marketing or their messaging? The

Tiago [00:42:18]:
Yep. So, I think we we covered a couple of them. So the the major one that I still see a lot is the the being generic. The Right. Generic.

James [00:42:26]:
That’s a

Tiago [00:42:27]:
big generic. Generic. I

James [00:42:28]:
love it.

Tiago [00:42:29]:
Being generic. Yeah. Trying to please everyone and pleasing no one specifically. Right? The that’s a big one. And then the other one is also, yeah, trying to put everything you know into your new program or into your service. Like, what the How do you call those? Not the library, but the encyclopedia kind of, the

James [00:42:50]:
Oh, sure.

Tiago [00:42:51]:
Everything here, the But but that kind of overwhelms the person on the side. Maybe she doesn’t need everything. It will just confuse her. So we should focus on, okay, for this specific the Urgent problem that she wants to solve now, quick, fast, you know, easy. One of the the few things that I can use from my arsenal that will take her the To where she wants to go, the faster, the easier, the less stressful way. So that forces you to, okay, not put everything you know in into one thing, the but just put the things that actually move the needle faster there, the 80/20. Right? Because the lighter that your program is, the shorter the the The time for the person to get the result. The quicker you get her give her quick wins.

Tiago [00:43:34]:
Right? The easier it will be for you to sell. Do you position the program like that? The and you can generate transformations quicker, faster, more reliably, because we’re in the results business. Right? And if we don’t generate results, we’re here just, the You know, playing playing around. No one wins out of it. We’re just losing time. Right? And you need testimonials and case studies, etcetera.

Tiago [00:43:57]:
The So, yeah, that’s another

Tiago [00:43:57]:
big mistake is try to to jam everything into your your one program. The Yeah. I think those are the main, the 2 main issues that I see that I love to work with. It’s like

James [00:44:07]:
Fair. Totally fair.

Tiago [00:44:08]:
My beach.

James [00:44:09]:
The That is so true. We’re definitely in the results business. So if the results aren’t if we’re not providing that that was one of the challenges that I had when I was coaching some of the the clients that I would coach. You’d give them the steps to take, and then you’d meet the next week or month or 2 weeks, whatever it was, depending upon their schedule. The and you’d be like, hey. Did you do your stuff? And they’d be like, I got busy, man. I don’t know. Kids, soccer, the locusts, whatever.

James [00:44:37]:
Just excuse, excuse, excuse. So you’re like, alright. Let’s just focus on today and just this goal moving forward. Here we go. Blah blah blah blah blah. Here’s your steps. Then you meet with them again, and I was like, hey. Did you do your stuff? I mean, like, the funny story, man.

James [00:44:50]:
There’s hurricanes, floods, earthquakes, my mother-in-law, all this stuff. The and then that happens a few times, and you’re like, I gotta cut you loose. I gotta cut you loose. I love your money. The happy big fan of green money. Right? It’s always good or whatever color it is in Portugal. Right? Like the money, but the if you’re not getting success from the work that I share with you because you’re not taking the steps. Right? Like, I can tell you how to do your push ups, but I can’t do your push ups for you.

Tiago [00:45:22]:
The Yep.

James [00:45:22]:
But you gotta take those steps. So there were a few clients where I’m just like, we gotta let you go. The and most of the time, it’s cordial and all that kind of stuff, but you’re just like you gotta be you as a client have to be willing to the to do the stuff that you’re paying someone to tell you what to do. So it’s interesting. I imagine most coaches run into something like that every once in a while.

Tiago [00:45:47]:
The Yeah. And, of course I did. I still was still for an accident here and there, but, the way I solve it and I try to to tell my clients to do the same is to need to be super selective the In who you let in, because you’re only gonna be as good as your clients allow you to be. Right?

Tiago [00:46:03]:
If you

Tiago [00:46:04]:
bring the wrong the Your own clients. You’re not gonna give them the results.

Tiago [00:46:06]:
I mean, you’re

Tiago [00:46:07]:
not gonna be good at your work. Right? So you should focus on like, that’s why the specificity is so so crucial. The Okay. Who’s the person? What is their context? What is their specific urgent problem they wanna solve right now? Because for example, if you’re helping the I’m helping, new entrepreneurs, to get to get leads online. And, you know you’re gonna be in trouble because first of all, they don’t have money to invest in you. The 2nd of all, you’re super distracted. They’re gonna fall into all the distractions, and they’re never gonna focus on doing something. So by default, you’re putting yourself in in the Prove problematic position.

Tiago [00:46:41]:
Right? So maybe focusing on more specific clients that you know that have the ability to buy and to implement what you are the offering. Right? That that that is super key. And and that you achieve that achieve that by being super specific on who you exactly the You serve and only accepting those people. No one else, that will protect you from, you know, those kind of situations. The And and your clients will be super happy because they they’re in the right context to succeed. They’re in the right mindset. They have the right resources, mental bandwidth, or whatever. The so, yeah, that that’s the key for you to stop having those kind of experiences you just described.

James [00:47:22]:
Nice. The I love it. Tiago, where can people find you?

Tiago [00:47:27]:
Yes. So, as I said, I’m I’m the beginning stages of the Personalizing my brands, but, you can still lurk me at Tiago Faria dotpt, Tiago Faria dot pt. The And you can if if you use Google Chrome, this Google translate, you can see what I’ve been doing before. Alright. And you can shoot me an email if you have any question or any comment about this strategy the Tiago at Tiago Fire. Pt. Or if you wanna have a chat with me, a quick call, a diagnostics call to see if you already have clients in your world, just the On the top right corner of my website, just book a call and, you can have fun.

James [00:48:00]:
Very cool. I do apologize. What is the dot p t? Is that for Portugal?

Tiago [00:48:05]:
The Yes. Portuguese

Tiago [00:48:05]:
PT. Okay.

James [00:48:06]:
Where does where does t come in Portugal?

Tiago [00:48:10]:
Or Chuga or Chuga. The

James [00:48:14]:
Okay. Well, look at me not knowing how to spell. Yay. Okay. Yeah. But that’s the truth. Gracious. That is the Yeah.

James [00:48:22]:
I guess in in North America here, I’m used to the Canadian one and whatever. Interesting.

Tiago [00:48:27]:
That’s true.

James [00:48:28]:
So I appreciate you being on the show, Tiago.

Tiago [00:48:31]:
The Thank you so much, sir. It was a real pleasure.

James [00:48:34]:
Yeah. If there’s

Tiago [00:48:35]:
took some info. I left here.

James [00:48:37]:
Yeah. If there’s one takeaway that you had to give for the the coaches that are listening to this thinking, I’m on the fence. I’m not really sure. I just need a little bit of thing just to the dip my toes in. What is the suggestion that you would have for them to do right now today at this moment?

Tiago [00:48:55]:
I think it’ll be to make that post that we talked about the, I the I wanna create an offer around this topic. Would you be willing to have a quick chat? It’ll be 10 to 15 minutes. I was wanting to know your opinion. Have your feedback on my the program that I’m creating. And with that, you are you can start talking to people and, things start happening. You know? When you start moving the needle, the opportunities will arise. And, I think that will be the a great first step, and you’ll get already get a cook potential quick wins out of it. If you create something around

Tiago [00:49:28]:
the What they told you they want to

Tiago [00:49:29]:
do, you can already have, a good start class like that.

James [00:49:32]:
That’s awesome. I love it. The low hanging fruit, and then work your way up the tree. Tiago, thank you so much for being on the show.

Tiago [00:49:40]:
Thank you so much, Chang. It was a true pleasure the Take puppies.

James [00:49:43]:
Yeah. This has been Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumphant successes of business owners across the land. The we are locally underwritten by the Bank of Sun Prairie. If you’re listening to this on the web, if you could do us a huge favor, give us a big old thumbs up, subscribe, the and, of course, share it with your entrepreneurial friends, especially those coaches that need to get the the word out there and get that the new clients coming in the that’s always good. Right? My name is James Kidman, and Authentic Business Adventures is brought to you by Calls on Call, offering call answering and receptionist services the for service businesses across the country on the web at callsoncallcom. And, of course, the bold business book, the a book for the entrepreneur, and all of us available wherever fine books are sold. We’d like to thank you, our wonderful listeners, as well as our guest, Thiago Ferdia, the business mentor for coaches and mentors with a unique anti marketing approach. Tiago, can you tell us your website one more time?

Tiago [00:50:41]:
The Yes. It’s t I a g o f r I a dot p t, Tiago Faria

James [00:50:47]:
dot Awesome. The past episodes can be found morning, noon, and night podcast link found at drawincustomerscom. Thanks for listening. We will see you next week. I want you to stay awesome. And if you do nothing else,

Tiago [00:51:06]:
this.