How to Build a BBQ Sauce Empire

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Walter Kinzie – Kinzie Foods

 

Podcast Overview:

00:00 Accidental business started with barbecue sauce gifts.
05:45 Started small, grew rapidly, expanded to flavors.
14:26 Twist top ensures clean barbecue sauce experience.
15:55 Targeting gourmet home chefs with diverse products.
22:15 Prioritizing quality and customer experience through investment.
26:16 Product for foodies excites more than essentials.
35:19 Family recipe requires precise cooking for flavors.
41:28 Dad orchestrated community show in small Kansas town.
43:22 Determined to produce presidential inauguration someday.
47:45 Countless decisions create meaningful, memorable events.
54:46 Networking chain leads to directing presidential transition.
01:01:30 Drive-in concerts brought joy during COVID shutdowns.
01:04:22 Band behavior reflects management’s communication failures.
01:09:02 Artist flopped; cover band quickly salvaged event.
01:15:10 Helped produce first CFP national championship game.

Podcast Transcription:

Walter Kinzie [00:00:00]:
And I made a, I made a commitment to myself that night on 2 things. Number 1, I verified that I absolutely did wanna put on concerts for a living, but number 2, also told myself I’d never let myself or anybody else limit how high I could go.

James Kademan [00:00:15]:
You have found Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumph and successes of business owners across the land. Downloadable audio episodes can be found in the podcast link found at draw in customers.com. We are locally underwritten by the Bank of Sun Prairie, calls on call extraordinary answering service, as well as the Bold Business Book. And today, we’re welcoming slash preparing to learn from Walter Kinsey of Kinsey Foods. And, Walter, before I get you going here, I just wanna let the audience know Walter has done way more than, I’m gonna dare say most of my guests, certainly more than me. So I’m excited to talk to you. Walter, how is it going today?

Walter Kinzie [00:00:57]:
Man, pleasure’s all mine. I’m grateful for this opportunity. And, you know, it’s going it’s a great day. And, you know, it’s a interesting day in America, but, Yeah.

James Kademan [00:01:07]:
It is.

Walter Kinzie [00:01:08]:
But, you know, across the board, I’m seeing a whole lot more optimism and excitement than, than maybe heartbreak. So I’m encouraged by that and, and really, really happy that, there seems to be at least some resolution. That’s the interesting thing about elections is so much of the day after isn’t about who won or who lost. It’s also just about that that process is over, and we know what the path forward is.

James Kademan [00:01:33]:
And Yeah.

Walter Kinzie [00:01:34]:
Anyway, it’s it’s a it’s, overall an optimistic and great day in America.

James Kademan [00:01:39]:
Yeah. It’s, I don’t know. I I treat it like a car accident where you finally got the estimate.

Walter Kinzie [00:01:45]:
That’s right. That’s right. So I’ve been

James Kademan [00:01:47]:
waiting for the day from the insurance company. We’ve been having this looming over our head, causing all kinds of turmoil, I suppose, depending upon how much you wanted to be open to the turmoil or not.

Walter Kinzie [00:01:57]:
Well, so many things in business and in life. It’s it’s you just gotta put one foot in front of the other every single day. And, but there’s always relief when you at least know what the path forward’s going to be. And Yeah. And, so there’s, there’s significant metaphors that absolutely apply in business and in life when, when you look at kind of the conclusion of what we’re seeing right now in America.

James Kademan [00:02:20]:
Yeah. I suppose it’s just like the, the sales thing. Right? You’ll take a yes. You’ll take a no, but the maybes are the worst.

Walter Kinzie [00:02:26]:
The maybes are the worst.

James Kademan [00:02:28]:
Now whether it’s a yes or no for what you’re, what you got, that’s, you know what it is. So acknowledge, improvise and move on.

Walter Kinzie [00:02:34]:
In retail, it’s called a be back. And those are the the as Ted lasso as the show Ted lasso, says it’s the hope that’ll kill you. It, in retail, it’s that be back. That’s like, oh, I bet they’ll be back. And you just wait, you wait, you wait, and then you never see it. And it’s

James Kademan [00:02:49]:
I’ve never heard that before. I gotta check

Walter Kinzie [00:02:52]:
that out. That’s awesome. Yeah. That’s

James Kademan [00:02:53]:
right. So So let’s start with Kinsey Foods. Walter, what is Kinsey Foods? Well, I

Walter Kinzie [00:02:58]:
it’s a, it’s been a fun business for us. It was a company that was started by accident, frankly. It was I did not set out and say, I’m just gonna revolutionize the barbecue industry. It was purely accident. And so my my background, I grew up a farmer in Kansas, And, my dad put on a concert at our county fair when I was 7 years old, and I told him right then, this is what I’m gonna do for a living. And we can spend as much time or as little time today talking about my history in in kinda large scale private public events. But for the last 20 years, that’s what I’ve done, produce concerts and and memorable moments around the world, including a presidential inauguration, that I’m very proud of. The, 4 or 5 years ago, I started handing out barbecue sauce as a gift to my clients.

Walter Kinzie [00:03:51]:
Whether you hired me to to throw a gig for you or if you were a celebrity that that we hired to work the the the event, We wanted I wanted to give a gift to these people that, that showed that I put some time in it, and it was an intentional gift. It was a a gift and that that I made. And, you know, fortunately for all of us, I’m not very good at crochet or anything like that. So Here’s your

James Kademan [00:04:15]:
sweater. Right?

Walter Kinzie [00:04:17]:
That’s right. I grew up I grew up on that on that little farm in Kansas. I grew up, you know, eating my aunt’s barbecue sauce. She had a flavor that was just so good. And and like so many of us, it was my aunt. So we loved it. But also, you know, we all have that that family member that makes something special that when your friends try, it’s like, you know, it’s special because you love that person, not because it’s great. And so, you know, we always loved it, but you never knew what we had.

Walter Kinzie [00:04:42]:
Anyway, I I started handing it out 4 or 5 years ago as gifts About 15 or 16 months ago, you know, we started getting phone calls, people asking for more of it, and I was flattered and very proud of it. You know, it’s my aunt’s deal. And so I was very proud of it, but we gave it away. Then about 15 or 16 months ago, I went to my wife one day in June and said, I can’t do this anymore. Like, we I literally had, like, almost 200 bottles to make over the weekend to just then Just to give away. Just to give away. And Well, that’s that’s

James Kademan [00:05:13]:
going beyond side hustle.

Walter Kinzie [00:05:15]:
Once they once they said, you know, you know, we love this. Can I get more? I was just flattered. So I did it. It just kinda started compounding on each other. There’s a little restaurant in Texas that was serving it, and it just become too much. And so, I figured the polite way, to tell people to leave me alone would be to put a price tag on it, something that would make sense. And so and and I really wanted them to leave me alone. I did not wanna do this, so I put a great big price tag on it.

Walter Kinzie [00:05:45]:
And and lo and behold, our 1st month, we had 600 bottles to make, and it was just like, oh, man. And then I was hopeful that they were buying it because they’ve been mooching off of me for so long that they’d buy it once and then leave us alone, but then Or is it curtsey? That’s it. The next month, we had, like, 1800 orders to fill, and and we were getting unbelievable feedback. That’s the other thing. Once someone starts paying for something, they feel like they can tell you what they think of it, which feedback is a gift and I treated it that way. And, and with that now, you know, is an expanded, flavor profile where we don’t just have the one flavor anymore. We’ve got 5 or 6 flavors and and we’re having fun with it. You know, we release we have 5 flavors available to buy online.

Walter Kinzie [00:06:26]:
Our other stuff, we do limited drops that are, you know, kind of special for customers only. And so we’re just having a lot of fun with it. And and I’ve assembled a a team of folks that some of them I’ve worked with in previous roles. Others are just kind of, had a lot of success in this industry. And and, man, every Monday morning, we have a call and and it’s just like we get to make we get to make little tweaks every day and then measure those results. And that’s something, you know, I I worked in retail years ago, and that’s something that I didn’t get in entertainment that I now get again. And it’s just, you know, we made one little tweak to an email campaign this week versus last week, and we saw a little traction. And it’s just fun.

Walter Kinzie [00:07:11]:
It’s fun to try that stuff and and, but we build a quality product. The customers seem to really like, and we’re just having a lot of fun with it. I’m not sure if that answers your question, but that’s a

James Kademan [00:07:21]:
good thing.

Walter Kinzie [00:07:21]:
That’s what we’re up to.

James Kademan [00:07:22]:
Absolutely. So

Walter Kinzie [00:07:23]:
We got

James Kademan [00:07:24]:
a lot of ground to cover with all that you have going on, but I did wanna dig in. Send us your aunt’s recipe.

Walter Kinzie [00:07:29]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:07:30]:
I know that I’ve talked to my grandma, I mean, years ago when she was alive, and you’d ask her like, hey. How do you make these chocolate chip cookies? And she’s like, well, you just put stuff together.

Walter Kinzie [00:07:40]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:07:41]:
Like, there’s no recipe or anything like that.

Walter Kinzie [00:07:43]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:07:43]:
I don’t know if you run into something like that with your aunt where you’re like, hey. How do you make this barbecue sauce? She’s like, hey. We throw some stuff together.

Walter Kinzie [00:07:50]:
No. No. No. Yeah. So here’s the thing. I am, you know, if you follow any of those, personality profiles, I’m your classic c profile. I’m full of energy, rare and blowing going, flying by the seat of my pants, have generally a game plan, a clear vision of where I wanna be, but the path to get there is murky. And that that also goes for the way I cook in my kitchen and the way that I you know, I love cooking.

Walter Kinzie [00:08:18]:
I love, preparing meals for my family. There’s no recipes. We’re just throwing things together. The barbecue sauce, it turns into a chemistry lab because I have to follow a very meticulous recipe. And then on top of that, it’s one thing to have the recipe. It’s another thing to have the process that you have to go about. And and and, you know, and I early on, as I was given this stuff away and wasn’t overly concerned about it, I for sure cut corners and you can you can tell a difference. And so now that that we’re taking this real serious, it’s, you know, we we I’ve got pros now that that help me make this stuff and and whatnot, but it’s a I mean, it’s a very meticulous process.

Walter Kinzie [00:09:01]:
You know, it’s food safety. You gotta, you gotta do it the right way. Not only, not only to preserve the quality of the product, but also to preserve the quality of the experience for the consumer. And so, I have no plans to make, unfortunate headlines because, you know, I, I cut corners or anything like that. So, it, which that’s also been really helpful or healthy for me because again, so much of my life has just been like blowing and going like a bull in a China bull in a China cabinet. And and but this, you know, I’ve taken the very methodical approach that I have to take to make a quality product. And I’m trying to apply those same practices in in this new endeavor I’m on and which is a very different approach. And so we’re being we’re being slow.

Walter Kinzie [00:09:44]:
We’re taking our time. We’re only interested in quality, hyper focused on the consumer experience, which is something that, you know, I’m I’m just a lot more intentional this time around than I have been with my other businesses.

James Kademan [00:09:59]:
Right here. Let’s talk about the the product itself. Because making barbecue sauce for your own for that meal or maybe for a week or something like that. I don’t know how much barbecue sauce you make at a time when it was just for you and your buddies kinda thing versus something that’s gotta be shelf stable, be in a package of glass bottle, plastic bottle, whatever. You gotta figure all that out. You gotta figure out how big is the bottle gonna be.

Walter Kinzie [00:10:22]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:10:23]:
Figure out what kind of cap we’re gonna use, what kind of machine, or where we’re getting this stuff actually either made or bottled, distributed. Just take me from the beginning when you went from, hey. This is kind of a hobby to, alright. We gotta do this on a bigger scale. Tell me what went through what kind of decisions did you have to make there?

Walter Kinzie [00:10:44]:
And that’s that’s a fantastic question. There’s a bunch of them there. I could have been really easy here. There’s a classic barbecue sauce bottle, both plastic and glass. Go to any Walmart, Target. Go to the aisle. You’re gonna see almost every single product is in this type of glass bottle or this type of plastic bottle. Would have been super easy for me to just say, hey, let’s just do this.

Walter Kinzie [00:11:10]:
But I’ll go back to that first decision. The first decision I ever made, for this business, again, was an attempt to try to shut it down, and I charged a huge price tag for it. So in a world where you can go into a Walmart aisle and buy a bottle of barbecue sauce, 20 ounces for $2.25, when you look at mine and I’m over $20 after tax. And so I am 10 x what what sauce cost at Walmart. And my customers it it it would be a lot of people could say, you know, the product inside the bottle is so good that you can justify that price. But for me, I’m highly sensitive to the customer, that first impression. Before they’ve ever tried it, they should look at it and say, okay. This is special.

Walter Kinzie [00:11:59]:
What that how that manifest is 20 plus, names. Like, what do I even name this company? 20 plus logo concepts, 100 of logo concepts, truthfully, across the board. How do I name this stuff? Do I you know, the first bottles whenever I was just shipping it out of out of my kitchen, for free. You know, my daughter, at the time was 7 years old, designed all of our logos, and she designed and we’d go to Home Depot and just print it off on a little sticker and put it on there, and it very much looked like a 4 h project. But, you know, there were cutesy little names and a cutesy little design by a 7 year old. And the whole thing’s still a family affair, but, you know, we had to we had to be really intentional about that. Like, what is our brand positioning going to be? Are we gonna have this little cutesy look at us? We’re a family operation sort of model. Are we gonna have this, you know, particularly, like, in the world of hot sauce, you have all these crazy labels and crazy names.

Walter Kinzie [00:13:02]:
You know? Are we gonna link lean in and be a part of that, or are we just gonna forge our own path? There’s a phenomenal case study through Harvard called the Blue Ocean Strategy, and they look at companies like Circus Olay. They look at Southwest Airlines. They look at a lot of these really big successful companies and and how they have really kind of they offer a product that’s incredibly similar or the exact same as a lot of the competitions, but they just go about it completely different. That’s the approach we decided to take here. We’re gonna have an ultra premium package. We’re gonna have an ultra sophisticated naming process. We’re gonna have a premium label, premium bottle, premium experience. And even from there, how we’ve had to iterate.

Walter Kinzie [00:13:41]:
Like, I I went for months, and I’d go over to a friend’s house. And I just opened up the refrigerator door, and I’d look at all the condiments on there. I’m looking at, like, crusty stuff around the lid and just, like, chunks of, like, you know, ketchup bottles, 3 fourths of the way empty, and there’s just chunks of stuff on the side of the bottle. Like, or do they, you know, do they have a nontransparent bottle so you can’t see that kind of dirty experience on the inside of it? And we were just hyper focused on how do we solve all of that. So from the very last drop, that customer has an ultra premium experience. And and, and so we’ve gone in, although I do think there’ll be another version of this in the in the within the next year. But right now, we’ve got this ultra premium bottle. It is plastic.

Walter Kinzie [00:14:26]:
But it’s got a twist top, which is kind of unheard of in barbecue sauce. I’ve manipulated the recipes so that, we get the same bold flavors, but it’s a very consistent pouring process with that suction cup of a, of a twist cap. So, you know, once you’ve applied what you need to what’s left behind is just a really clean experience in your refrigerator. So the, from the first time you use it till the very end, you know, you don’t get any of the disgusting stuff that typically happens. The other thing we had to do, was you look at the barbecue sauce market, and it is it is rapidly growing. And and and really thanks to the, some of the stuff that happened during COVID that created so many at home chefs, there are markets in this country, gigantic markets in this country that have very little presence of barbecue. And so it’d be one thing to to to build it and and and try to keep it in that same mold, where you you apply it to meats that you’re smoking. So ribs, pulled pork, brisket, whatever it might be.

Walter Kinzie [00:15:26]:
But that’s not what our customers were telling us. Our customers were telling us, you know, we put this on our scrambled eggs in the morning. We put this on our tacos. We put this on our burgers. And so we’ve been really, really intentional to position ourselves that this is kind of an everyday, every meal, everything kind of sauce. And we’ve got a unique flavor profile across our 5 predominant flavors that it doesn’t matter what the meal is. Chances are we’ve got a nice little compliment to it. And, and so we recognize that our price point is is not gonna be for everyone.

Walter Kinzie [00:15:55]:
But, you know, if you’re that if you’re that person that that goes ahead and buys the sea salt on the cracked pepper container, or, you know, you’re that at home chef that just likes to go a little bit further to, to make sure that your meal is over the top, then we’ve got multiple products for you. And that’s really the customer base that we’re going after. And we’re we’re increasing the application use of which differentiates us from the rest of the market. And so there’s a few of the decisions, but it it’s it’s been really insane, for me on just how intentional every single step of the way. My goodness. Our website. You know? Again, Shopify and some of these profiles make it so easy to throw something up there. And if we wanted to just kinda fit in, I could have a site live in in in a couple hours, just kind of fumbling my way through as an amateur on Shopify.

Walter Kinzie [00:16:44]:
But I brought in some folks that have had a lot of success there, and, and it’s a risk. You know, it’s a more expensive way to go, but, you know, we’re we’re 5 months in and still, you know, 2 people working all day every day to make little tweaks to it. We’re just hyper focused that every single turn, the customer’s having a great experience. They’re enjoying the process. They they buy the product in a very efficient way. It’s delivered in a beautiful package, not, you know, very different from what you would normally get when you buy online. And then you open it up. You should be super impressed with the bottle once you look at it.

Walter Kinzie [00:17:18]:
And then once you try it, you’re just gonna be blown away. And, and so to have that experience, and I’m not pretending like we’re pros at any of that yet, but, but to have that experience, that is a hard, expensive way to go. But for us, it’s the way we’re gonna choose to go. And, and and for us, we just made the decision that we’re gonna go about it slower instead of ramping up super fast. You know, there’s some disadvantages to doing it the way that we’re doing it. And one of it is you can’t move as fast as other companies, and and we’ve made the conscious decision that we’re okay with that.

James Kademan [00:17:51]:
Fair. Totally fair. You know, it’s so interesting. You’re talking about the packaging and going through it to get the consistency as was the viscosity of the sauce to a point that it can be applied where your customers are applying it. And the packaging, I imagine when they receive it in the mail that there’s a I don’t know if ceremony is the right word, but it reminds me of some things where you get where they’re just like, some kid threw this in the box, didn’t give a care. I can remember I bought a power steering pump recently. That’s pretty heavy object Yeah. That was in a box about 5 times the size of it with no packing material in it.

James Kademan [00:18:29]:
Oh my goodness. I feel like there’s not a whole lot of care here because I gotta go through the process of changing this thing, which I hope it works. It’s tough.

Walter Kinzie [00:18:37]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:18:38]:
But where other products, it’s almost like we gotta light candles to open this thing. This is amazing.

Walter Kinzie [00:18:46]:
I’ve been I’ve been very very pleased with the number of people that will send us an email or, find us online somehow, and they have taken a picture of just the package. They haven’t even opened it yet. They’ve taken a picture of the package in excitement and anticipation that it’s arrived. And and, you know, it is. It is it’s not overly complicated what we’re doing, but, you know, it’s I I equate it. We’re not on this level by any means, but I equate it to, like, when you buy that new Apple product. And it’s one thing, you know, to open it, pull the plastic off, and it, you know, foam reveal itself. But, you know, the box opens super slow, and you got this little piece of tape there, but it’s got this little arrow that shows you exactly how to pull it.

Walter Kinzie [00:19:34]:
So it just cuts off clean, and you’re not having to find a pocket knife or anything like that. We’re nowhere near that level, but our site is on that. And and that’s where we’re headed. And so and I, you know, I know I’m doing it right at least at this stage in the game when customers are are sending pictures of just the package saying, this is we’re really excited.

James Kademan [00:19:54]:
Well, I think this speaks volumes because it shows that you’re aware of things that a lot of people either they think, hey. That’s not important, or it’s just not even on their radar, or they’re not willing to take the time to design it or pay for it.

Walter Kinzie [00:20:10]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:20:11]:
One of those things where I’m like, something on that level I mean, so much stuff seems to be disposable throw away. It’s obvious or it seems to be that people didn’t care. Like, you’re spending money with them regardless if you’re spending 2 or $3 or $20. You’re still spending money with them. And it would be nice to know that the people you’re spending money with care on some level that they have you as a client.

Walter Kinzie [00:20:37]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:20:38]:
And I’m like, what really is the cost difference between giving them just something thrown in a box versus something that’s almost ceremonial? Is it really that significant?

Walter Kinzie [00:20:48]:
Well, I’ll I’ll tell you one thing that I I take pretty serious. I said earlier, I used to work in retail. When I left that retail job, the CEO of the company made a comment to me, and he just said, you know, you’re starting something new. I’m not gonna tell you how to spend your money, but, like, you’re gonna have to go buy laptops and cell phones and things like that for your employees. And he said, the company I’m leading today, when when that company started, we made the conscious decision. We’re buying the cheapest laptops you can buy. We’re buying the cheapest cell phones you can buy. We’re buying all of that stuff.

Walter Kinzie [00:21:22]:
And he said, now we’re huge. And they are. They were a 4 and a half $1,000,000,000 company at the time that I left. But he said, now for us to make the decision that we actually should probably get Macs for all of our employees and we should actually get iPhones for all of our employees, it is a painful, highly expensive, transformational way of thinking to make that switch. And he said, I’m again, I’m not gonna tell you how to run your business or how to spend your money, but if you think there’s a chance that one day your employees are gonna need MacBook Pros, start there because it is going to be incredibly difficult. It is so much easier to save money or cut costs than it is to say, darn it. For us to get the results we need, we gotta spend a lot more money. And it is way easier to go one way than it is the other.

Walter Kinzie [00:22:15]:
And so I took that seriously entertainment company, and, and and I’m taking it serious here where I would rather overspend, to your point, you know, all these products I’m buying to give my customer the experience of a of a direct to consumer experience. I gotta buy these things anyway. So I’m just spending a little bit more to get quality, spending a little bit more time to package it the right way. I’m spending a little bit it’s just little things here and there that I am taking it further and I am spending a little bit more than what it could be done for. But I’d rather look up in a few years and say, you know what? We can we can make these cuts and have the same customer experience than it would be to say, we really need to layer in all of this stuff and, you know, on a much bigger scale. That’s just a way more painful way to go. And so, it, again, may not be the smart way to do it. We’ll know in 5, 6, 7 years whether it was the right decision.

Walter Kinzie [00:23:12]:
But for now, the thrill of the journey and, the reaction we’re getting from customers is is kind of all the evidence I need. Let’s take the time, let’s spend a little bit more, and and give them an experience they deserve versus, you know, cheap bottle, cheap package, cheap packaging, delivered slowly, you know, and, and and arrives in a in in something that’s not gonna keep. Yeah. It’s not what we’re doing.

James Kademan [00:23:37]:
Get what you’re saying there. It’s funny. It reminds me of some of the packages my wife gets from Amazon because I don’t know why she orders so much, but she does. Sometimes I feel like we’re keeping them afloat. I know we’re not. You you

Walter Kinzie [00:23:50]:
and I collectively might be. So,

James Kademan [00:23:52]:
But she’s, like, by the front door. And this is my little social experiment that because I’m somewhat of a jerk that way. Like, packages left by the front door. I bring it in, set it by the front door but inside the house. And sometimes that package will go a week before it’s even touched or opened. Mhmm. And I’m like, that means that she bought this thing with the anticipation of whatever it is. Right? But it’s obviously not life threatening.

James Kademan [00:24:17]:
And whatever it is probably isn’t even that important.

Walter Kinzie [00:24:21]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:24:22]:
Kinda like In

Walter Kinzie [00:24:23]:
the moment. Like, if

James Kademan [00:24:24]:
there was more of a something that would get people excited, like, hey. Santa Claus is here, man. We gotta open this up. Instead, he just like, oh, it’s another brown package.

Walter Kinzie [00:24:36]:
That’s right. Well, so what what I would tell you and and this is something I so first of all, you and my experience is very similar. But what that also tells me is that she’s doing business with a company that has been highly effective at building the excitement and the thrill of the purchase Correct. On on something that they may they’ve been really good at that. They haven’t got it right on the other end. And that may not matter, you know, that may not matter at all because they got your money, man. They got your money. And you know what? You’re gonna go outside today, and they’re gonna be a few more packages at your front door.

Walter Kinzie [00:25:11]:
That volume doesn’t change. And so so for us, we are taking that side of it serious, but, you know, we also want people to have that other experience. We think that other experience, because we sell one product in a in a very, very intentional way, you know, we need them to be, you know, Christmas morning whenever that thing shows up and and then excited that they can redo this in 45 days when when they’re running low and it’s time to refill. So

James Kademan [00:25:41]:
Yeah. It’s interesting because I’m thinking when somebody gives me a gift, I wanna say that I don’t care how it’s wrapped. But if you think if someone gave you a gift and it was in just a old grocery bag versus a gift that’s in either a nice bag or wrapped, and you knew that when you opened it, confetti was gonna pop out. Those are 2 different experiences.

Walter Kinzie [00:25:59]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:26:00]:
Even if inside is a bag of money, you’re still like, oh, you put you wrapped it up here. That’s so nice. Right?

Walter Kinzie [00:26:06]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:26:08]:
It’s so interesting because I’m like, it doesn’t matter, but then you’re like, it kinda does. I don’t want it to, but it does.

Walter Kinzie [00:26:16]:
And, you know, within your world and within your hobbies and within the things that really bring you joy, I bet that the way the products involved in that joy and the way you interact with those, that’s a different experience for you than maybe when the deodorant shows up or the toothpaste shows up, you know. And there’s there’s a different urgency, there’s a different anticipation, there’s a different level of excitement and, you know and for all of us, that’s different. And for us, you know, we’re just hyper focused that we believe that there’s enough foodies in this world that are are in the country that that really enjoy the process of of making a great meal. And we’re we’re providing a necessary tool that that allows them no matter how the meal turns out, that allows them to just know confidently that their guests or themselves are going to enjoy it. And so, and so we’re hopeful that that segment of people, gets a little more excited when our package shows up than maybe when the deodorant shows up.

James Kademan [00:27:17]:
Fair. You know, a lot of worlds were conquered or fought or people were willing to risk falling off the edge of the earth to make their food a little spicier.

Walter Kinzie [00:27:27]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:27:27]:
So I feel like you’re in the right world right there.

Walter Kinzie [00:27:30]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:27:31]:
Tell me a story about how did you decide on the volume. The, like, given bottle. You see some some bottles of whatever, whether it’s ketchup, mustard, barbecue sauce, whatever, beer. I mean, I suppose beer is pretty standard, but you got some that are, like, 6.25 ounces or 9.87 ounces. Right. Where are they coming up with these numbers, or are they just like, that’s the one? Is it based on dollar and then work backwards, or is it machine and work backwards, or where are they figuring that out?

Walter Kinzie [00:28:00]:
Yeah. So for most of them, that’s exactly what it is. It is the machine that they’re producing the product in and how that product gets ported to the to the vessel, and then it’s driven by cost. And, you know, when you’re selling a product at Walmart for $2.25, you’ve got to cut a lot of corners to eke out even just a little bit of margin per unit. And so the decision and the the vessel and all of that is derived from that experience. You know, we’re going direct to consumer. I’m not worried about, taking retail hits and and margin hits from having distributors and bookers and retail shelves involved. And so for me, everything was driven.

Walter Kinzie [00:28:37]:
It was it was less about the ounces, and it was more about what is the right vessel. And, one of these days, I’ll show you, but right over here off to the side, there’s probably 250 bottles on my counter that range everywhere from, half an ounce to 22 ounces. And, for me, it wasn’t about how much product is inside of that bottle. It is what is the bottle that works best with my product? So it has a really nice pour experience that just every step of the way, the customer has an enjoyable experience. Our flavors are super bold. And so unlike a lot of sauces where you just I’m I’m picturing my daughters and the amount of ketchup that goes onto a plate to coat the chicken nugget, to get it where it needs to be. You just don’t have to have that much with me. Our our flavors are super bold.

Walter Kinzie [00:29:27]:
And and so regardless of the ounces, our product lasts longer in your kitchen or in your refrigerator than than something else where you need a lot of it to get you where you need to be. And so for me, it was what is the right vessel that gives you the right amount of control so you can control how much you you know, you’re think about how many times you tip that bottle over and you beat the car out

James Kademan [00:29:51]:
of it. Right. Right.

Walter Kinzie [00:29:52]:
And then and then it finally comes out. It’s just way too much and you just coat it. So for me, it was all about the experience for the customer. And once I found the vessel that gave that customer the experience, then it was just, what is it? And and ironically, the bottle itself, is a 12 ounce bottle, but, the weight of my product is is much heavier than water weight. And so, so it’s a the vessel itself is a 12 ounce vessel that serves 14 ounces of product. And, again, that I wasn’t trying to have a 14 ounce product. I wasn’t going for any of that. I was going for the experience.

Walter Kinzie [00:30:26]:
And and the ounces will change when I switch to glass. Again, not because, I’ve got this magic number in mind, but I have finally selected a glass bottle that that frankly we’re having custom made for us and and whatnot. And for but for us, it again, it wasn’t, the amount that was inside of the bottle as much as do they have a world class experience when they’re interacting with this thing. And, and I feel like we got there. And so the ounces will change when we go to glass, but it’s only because I want the customer to have the best possible experience interacting with the with the product. And that’s that’s what we’ve done here. So

James Kademan [00:31:05]:
No. You raise an interesting point because I’m picturing this as you say that 14 ounces of product in 12 ounce bottle. Like, you gotta consider you got a 5 year old kid that still gotta lift it. Right? It can’t be some 5 gallon jug or something.

Walter Kinzie [00:31:18]:
That’s right. You

James Kademan [00:31:18]:
gotta think all the different hand sizes and how does it fit on the table, how does it fit in the fridge. Man, there are so many variables here. That is

Walter Kinzie [00:31:27]:
How it fits on a shelf, how it fits inside of the fridge, you’re exactly right. Like and frankly, there was a glass bottle that we loved, and then I literally went. I went to put it in my fridge. I was like, I’ve gotta adjust the shelves in here for this thing to fit. We can’t do that. And so and I mean, we had already we were so confident that that that was the bottle that we were gonna use. And then all of a sudden, I’m like, oh, boy. This isn’t gonna work.

Walter Kinzie [00:31:51]:
You know? Nobody gets a refrigerator. So few people get a refrigerator and say, oh, I’m gonna adjust the shelf heights here. The way it’s delivered 99 times out of a 100 is just how you’re and we figured out that this bottle was gonna require everyone to physically adjust the shelves in the refrigerator. And that’s

James Kademan [00:32:10]:
Never happened.

Walter Kinzie [00:32:10]:
Step I’m unwilling to make the customer go through. And so it’s, you know, there there’s a lot into it, the width of the bottle. So today, you know, we are direct to consumer. One day, we will be on shelves, though, and it’s like, you know, you wanna have a desirable positioning on the shelf to where, you know, it’s they can fit us in in a lot easier format than they could have a product. So, all of those things, again, asked me 15 months ago, I would have been like, who cares? And now it’s it’s just been a lot of fun just how methodical we’ve had to be. And, you know, like I said, we’re we’re learning every step of the way. We’re making our fair share of mistakes. And, but we’re we’re we’ve approached it knowing that we’re gonna mess a lot of stuff up.

Walter Kinzie [00:32:56]:
And, but we’re we’re committed to to fixing it and and adjusting it. And we’re we’re looking forward to the mistakes, and anticipating them so that we can get that mistake behind us and know that, alright, at least this part of the journey is solved for for at least this period of of time. So, and and that’s different for me. You know, in the live event world, no no event ever goes off the way that you think it’s gonna go off, but it has to go off. If it doesn’t go off, you’ve got a world of problems. And so there’s very little room for error there, and and every error is a is is a catastrophe. And and that’s just not the experience here, which is making us a lot of fun where we we’ve got the margin to make some mistakes and built in the bandwidth, when those mistakes happened, you know, be able to take care of the people that that might be on the the negative end of those mistakes. So we’re we’re having fun with it.

James Kademan [00:33:54]:
That’s fair. It’s the definition of entrepreneurship. Right? Make enough money that you can afford the mistakes you make.

Walter Kinzie [00:34:00]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:34:01]:
And that’s just early

Walter Kinzie [00:34:02]:
stage, it’s not even about the money as much as the time or the experience. Fair. Fair. We put we put that stuff into place. We had you know, I had my we we’ve now fortunately been shipping thousands of bottles of this stuff. And, but I had our our very first one a couple weeks ago where the customer sent me the picture and the bottle had exploded and, on delivery. And it was just like but but I I was very proud that within an hour, she already had her new shipping label in hand and she and the and the tracking number and the replacement stuff was on the way. And and, and so it’s even just like it’s even factoring in in that margin of time that we can we can be flexible like that.

Walter Kinzie [00:34:47]:
And, and because of the way we control a lot of the experience, you know, we’re not having to jump through 15 different hoops to get a replacement order out there. We jump through a couple different hoops in a very efficient way with the fewest number of people possible and, and have a happy and satisfied customer, you know, within a matter of, of a of a short period of time. And that’s that’s the experience we’re looking for.

James Kademan [00:35:09]:
That’s awesome. Tell me a story about when you shifted just cooking stuff. Or I don’t do you cook barbecue sauce, or do you mix it?

Walter Kinzie [00:35:16]:
I don’t

James Kademan [00:35:16]:
even know. I have no idea how you make barbecue sauce.

Walter Kinzie [00:35:19]:
You do both of those things, but it is it is a cooked product that in order to get the flavor profiles the way that you need them, you gotta cook all the ingredients in a certain order, to a certain temperature, in order to achieve the profiles that you’re looking for. And so, you know, I was very fortunate. My my aunt had been making this stuff for 40 or 50 years, and she, and she walked me through it. It wasn’t, you know, it wasn’t a complicated thing, but she walked me through, you know, take these steps, take them serious, and do it the right way. And you can have fun in these areas, but you can’t have fun in these areas. And, you know, she it was it was teaching me where I could take the liberty to make adjustments that ultimately allowed me to thrive with these new flavors. And, and, you know, and and truthfully, the exact family recipe is is reserved for the family. What goes out to market, is is a variation of that that is just outstanding.

Walter Kinzie [00:36:26]:
People love it. But, you know, with how this came about, it was very important to me to to keep a certain element for the way it was always intended to be. And and and so I’ve I’ve loved honoring her in that way. Her name is Anne Kinsey. And so, even though my last name’s Kinsey, the company is named after my aunt honor her. And, and, and she’s just a, a woman I’m, I’m proud to be a relative of. And, and she’s, she’s had some great times in her life. She’s had some hard times in her life and I can never, even from the littlest kid, I can never remember a time where she didn’t just have the biggest smile on her face.

Walter Kinzie [00:37:03]:
And so, and, and she’s gonna get rewarded in all of this. You know, if there’s a if there’s a meaningful exit down the road somewhere, I look forward to to changing her life. And so, but, yeah, it’s, a kind of went in a in a few different directions there. But, yeah, it’s it is you you cook it. It’s, it’s a very methodical and essential process to get the result that we’ve got. And, it’s something I enjoy. I do, I’m very happy that we have people that make it for us now.

James Kademan [00:37:35]:
Okay. I was gonna ask that because I wonder, like, how do you go from kitchen to cauldron? Mhmm. Gotta get this, like Yeah.

Walter Kinzie [00:37:42]:
There’s You gotta make a few

James Kademan [00:37:43]:
bottles, no big thing. When you gotta make 100, now we’re talking some industrial type equipment.

Walter Kinzie [00:37:48]:
That’s exactly right. And, and there’s elements of the process that I still manage in house. The shipping component of it, I talked earlier about how we were able to take care of that customer so fast. Part of it is because I keep a healthy amount of of inventory here. So at a moment’s notice, if somebody’s caught up, I’m able to ship it, and and get it out very efficiently or my wife or whatever. And so the, and so but, yeah, it it was a very happy day in our household when we made the decision to outsource the cooking. There there’s cottage laws, which is something I didn’t was a term I wasn’t even familiar with in all of these states. And, you know, thankfully, in the state that I live in, there’s a lot of liberty to to create this stuff and build a little business, and it’s a very pro business, pro small business state.

Walter Kinzie [00:38:35]:
And so, and so we really enjoyed the benefits of that for a while, but then it just you know, it came to a point where I had to ask myself, am I gonna be out there representing the brand, or I’m gonna be behind closed doors, producing the brand.

James Kademan [00:38:46]:
Very. And,

Walter Kinzie [00:38:47]:
and, and so it’s, it’s best for everyone that we just, we let the pros make it. And, and I’m, I’m focused on just talking about it and introducing it to folks.

James Kademan [00:38:59]:
Yeah. I mean, just consistency of the product. And I imagine just the capital expense of the equipment that you would need, the space, the time, there comes a point where you’re just like, what is my goal here?

Walter Kinzie [00:39:11]:
That’s right. That’s right. And you know, these deals right now is a virtually brand new business with in the, in the, in the overall world of this industry. I’m I’m so small and just insignificant that, you know, these, these manufacturers, the, the deals are definitely in their favor now, but I’m looking forward to growing this to a point where I’ll have options and we’ll be able to have more favorable terms and you’re right. You know, to have the, the USDA approved space or an FDA approved space with all that equipment be very expensive. It’s also very expensive to say, hey. I need you to produce 500 gallons of this, and I gotta pay for it up front before it gets produced. And Oh.

Walter Kinzie [00:39:50]:
And so, you know, it’s a that’s a huge amount of money out of pocket just like that, but it is nice that couple weeks later, it just shows up, and it’s ready to go and ready to

James Kademan [00:40:00]:
You don’t have to wait for the health inspector to come on by or find out that your employee didn’t show up or

Walter Kinzie [00:40:06]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:40:06]:
That your gas burner’s dirty so it’s not doing its thing or pay for the hood.

Walter Kinzie [00:40:11]:
That’s exactly right.

James Kademan [00:40:12]:
Suck all the fumes out or have your wife say, and you’re cooking barbecue sauce again.

Walter Kinzie [00:40:17]:
That’s right. Well, some of our flavors are pretty spicy. There are let me rephrase that. Some of our flavors have a spice element to it, and I use what are traditionally really hot peppers, but I cook a lot of the heat out of it. That cooking a lot of heat out of it means a lot of sneezing and a lot of tears with with the with the fumes and stuff roaming around. And so, but I still, you know, I still tweak and and invent new flavors down here. So I’m constantly, you know, innovating new stuff, and I’m I’m still the one behind all of that. So so even though we’ve outsourced a lot of that, they still get their healthy dose of me experimenting with peppers and different things like that to see if I can come up with something that that we’re proud of.

James Kademan [00:41:00]:
I get that. That’s all part of the game. That’s all

Walter Kinzie [00:41:02]:
part of the game. That’s right.

James Kademan [00:41:03]:
Let’s shift gears into your event business. Tell us about that. It looks like you had a lot of cool stuff going on. Presidential inauguration back in 2017. You got some awesome incredible bands. Tell us that story.

Walter Kinzie [00:41:17]:
Yeah. So that, what I mentioned it earlier. I told my dad when I was 7 years old, I was gonna put on concerts for a living. And I had

James Kademan [00:41:25]:
Was your dad playing, or was he Nope. Sound good?

Walter Kinzie [00:41:28]:
Or was he We grew up in a really, really small town, in Kansas. And, I was very involved with 4H and FFA. And, when I was very young, my dad drew the short straw, of the adults from our 4 h chapter. And in one summer, he was in charge of the entertainment component. My dad’s an entrepreneur and he’s he’s a barber and, and, and had a little bit of a of a local and regional political, profession for a little while, but and he’s, he’s just a super great guy and super involved in this community. So I know he had a lot of fun with it, but it’s not what he does. And so, and growing up in a town of just a few 100 people, then watching my dad produce this show and I was looking out from the stage, and I just never seen so many people in a room or in one space ever before as a rodeo arena. But there are few hundred people there.

Walter Kinzie [00:42:23]:
I’d never seen that many people in one spot before. And I was just, like, amazed that something my dad made caused all these people to wanna be there, at that one time. And, and I just saw a lot of joy that night. And so I I committed to doing it. I did my first show when I was 18 years old. There was a kind of a profound reason for doing it. A friend of mine was terminally ill. And we kind of figured out how much money his family needed to help him achieve a few things before the illness finally got him.

Walter Kinzie [00:42:53]:
And and what was interesting was we set a goal to raise $70,000 for him, and we used a concert to do it. $70,000 is a lot of money. And we used a concert to do it. I was 18 years old, and and we went out and we did it. And what’s interesting is, you know, we were dead set for the entire planning process. We were gonna raise $70,000. We raised $71,000. And I I I was driving home that night, and I just thought to myself, what if I would’ve said we need to raise $250,000?

James Kademan [00:43:22]:
I

Walter Kinzie [00:43:22]:
feel very firmly that we would’ve raised it. Like, we set our mind to do something, and I made a I made a commitment to myself that night on 2 things. Number 1, I verified that I absolutely did wanna put on concerts for a living. But number 2, also told myself I’d never let myself or anybody else limit how high I could go. And, and, man, the dreaming started right then. You know, artists that I had no business ever doing business with, milestones in in, you know, society that you look at things like a Super Bowl halftime show or opening ceremonies to an Olympics or a presidential swearing in ceremony. And and I kinda weighed all of the options and decided way early that I one day I’m gonna produce a presidential inauguration. And and, that was just more interesting to me than than those other two options I threw out there.

Walter Kinzie [00:44:17]:
And and and and it’s amazing when with with anything in life, when you set your mind to something, it it and you’re and you’re committed to it, it’s incredible how it could happen. I didn’t care what candidate I produced an inauguration for. I just wanted to do it. And and and I got to do it. And it was it was really, really, a a special experience. And so but, you know, I look back now on a career that that started out as a dream when I was 7. I’m 41 years old now. Collectively, we’ve done over 5,000 events in countless countries around the the world.

Walter Kinzie [00:44:56]:
I’ve I’ve worked with some of the most predominant entertainers, predominant families and companies. The world I live in in events is predominantly, private, private events, which is a you know, I grew up in a poor farming community in Kansas. Lot of people that I love and a lot of love and joy, but not a lot of money. And so now I look at some of these things that I’ve thrown over the years that that, you know, we’re spending more money an hour than most people will see in their entire life. And it’s just been a really kind of pinch me moment over and over again. And, and I’m just, you know, I’m proud of, of what we built and what we’ve done. You look back now, we’ve done over half a $1,000,000,000 in private events. And, and it’s it’s been, it’s been a remarkable journey throughout the whole way.

James Kademan [00:45:46]:
That is cool. I can remember I’m trying to think last concert that I was at. It’s been a while. It may oh, I don’t know if it was Garth Brooks in Saint Louis or, I guess, as far as large venue. And I remember looking around where the concert starts at whatever. Well, ticket says 7, but it’s really, like, 9:30 or whatever.

Walter Kinzie [00:46:08]:
Yeah.

James Kademan [00:46:08]:
And so you’re just killing time looking around the building. And I remember looking at that soundboard. Huge. And the wires coming in and out of that thing and the guys that they have moving in and out of the tables looking at all that stuff. This is before the concerts even started. You’re not getting that the guys that are dressed all in black that are moving stuff around, throwing guitars around. You see the speakers. And I’m trying to think what that venue was normally.

James Kademan [00:46:35]:
It was a basketball stadium or whatever it was. It doesn’t matter. It’s not normally a concert venue.

Walter Kinzie [00:46:40]:
Yeah.

James Kademan [00:46:40]:
And I thought, what did it take to put this together? And how far out did they have to schedule it? How did they find the people, the crew, figure out the speakers, the wires, all that jazz, and then make sure it doesn’t go off without a hitch regardless of how big that crowd is. It is insane insane how many decisions have to have been made correctly. And for people to do what they’re paid to do or do what they said they were gonna do. It’s impressive.

Walter Kinzie [00:47:10]:
It’s, you know, I’ve I’ve been very fortunate. I’ve got to work with Garth a lot. And, and I’ve, you know, I’ve worked with a lot of artists. And for me, the, there’s a whole lot of steps that are just really exhilarating for me. But to this day, you know, logged over 5,000 of these things in my career. To this day for me, the moment where it’s all worth it is, you know, I’ll I’ll back into it. You know, you have you get the gig, and then the planning starts. You assemble the team.

Walter Kinzie [00:47:45]:
All of those things. The wire, but it’s, you know, it’s all the food and beverage. It’s all the hotels, all the air flights, ground transportation, security, staffing, ticket takers, ticketing system, ticketing what are you gonna charge for this stuff? How are you back into it? All thousands and thousands and thousands of decisions that have to be made, to get to a point where ultimately I’m standing on the side of a stage and I’m looking around to, you know, sometimes it’s 100 of people because it’s a really intimate event. Sometimes it’s thousands of people, but regardless, I’m looking around that all of these people could have been anywhere tonight. They chose to be right here because of all of those thousands of decisions we made to give them a reason. You know, people who have hard jobs or hard lives, everyone’s going through something. And I was the thing that they circled on their calendar that got them through that week that, you know, it didn’t matter how hard it was because on Saturday or on Friday, this thing’s happening, and and now they’re there. And then it’s that exact moment where I’m standing side stage.

Walter Kinzie [00:48:53]:
I look at all these people that are there, and I can see the artist walking up. They’re getting closer and closer. And the stage lights dim. The whole stadium or room erupts and cheers. And, and and then the artist steps up to the microphone in in one way or another, greets the crowd, and you can hear them Because all of those wires and all of those decisions and all of those steps that it took to get the artists there, to give them what they need so that they can do their thing, and it works. That moment where where they greet the crowd and the crowd goes nuts. I mean, I got hair on my arm standing up right now, just thinking about it. I’m, you know, there’s, there’s so many things in life that are interesting to you, but you do it enough and kind of the interesting part wears off.

Walter Kinzie [00:49:44]:
I’m, I’m, I’m several thousand of these things in, and just talking about it makes the hair on on my arm stand up. I’m in the right industry, and I love what I do. So I

James Kademan [00:49:56]:
get that.

Walter Kinzie [00:49:56]:
It’s been, you know, but it’s also an interesting industry because, you know, with what I do, which is predominantly in the private world, so it it’s a very cutthroat deal to do these public ones. And I’ve done a few public ones, but it’s very, very cutthroat, very tough break into that. A lot of big, big companies that make it tough to break into it. But the private world, I’ve got a ton of opportunity there, but it doesn’t matter what the name of my company is. You know, my clients are hiring me. They want me to be the one that’s making those thousands of decisions, because they trust that when I’m involved, it’s gonna go the right way. And so what that ultimately means for a business is it doesn’t matter how successful you are. You have a service based business that’s worth nothing.

Walter Kinzie [00:50:38]:
I am the common denominator. And if for whatever reason, I convince somebody to pay me a bunch of money for my entertainment company. It’s not like these billionaires that I work for are gonna say, oh, well, well, I guess I have to use this other person now to plan my party. They’re gonna be like, no. I’m calling Walter. It doesn’t matter what’s on the business card. They they want me. And so that’s been a really, really motivating and driving force behind Kenzie Foods is is now I have an opportunity to build something that is much bigger than me and much, much bigger than what I, you know, we’re building a brand and we’re building a product that that people are loving and, and it will have inherent value.

Walter Kinzie [00:51:17]:
And so in one of these days, I’ll get to, hopefully, God willing, I’ll get to, experience the joy of an exit that that that a lot of business leaders, enjoy. And, but something that, frankly, the company I’ve loved building over the last 20 years is just, you know, not gonna do something like that. So, so it’ll be it’ll be a a different conclusion, god willing, the than what I could have over here that’ll bring me equal joy to this other stuff. So I have made some adjustments to the entertainment business. I am taking on way less projects now. I’ve kinda refined what I am willing to do and what I’m not willing to do. You know, in the last few days, I’ve asked some you know, it’s a very, very small, group of people in this world that have ever produced a presidential inauguration. And so, when these things come around, my phone tends to ring and as it has over the last few days.

Walter Kinzie [00:52:14]:
And, and, but respectfully, you know, doing 2 of these things does nothing for your resume. Doing one of them does a lot for your resume. 2 of them does nothing for your resume. So, if I was younger or didn’t have a family, maybe I’d consider it. But, you know, what’s best for me and my family right now is I stay focused on Kinsey foods, do a few of these, events and, and and build a brighter future and and frankly be home for most nights. So, which I would not be able to do if I was in DC for the next 90 days planning something. So

James Kademan [00:52:44]:
So tell me about the inauguration thing just and this is pure curiosity.

Walter Kinzie [00:52:48]:
Sure.

James Kademan [00:52:49]:
Because I I can’t say that I’ve ever watched 1, so I don’t even know. Is this an intimate thing where you got a few 100 people there, or is this, if the country is there kinda thing? I have no idea.

Walter Kinzie [00:53:01]:
No. We had, for the 1 in 2017, I don’t think we despite what some of the headlines might say in either direction, you know, we had a whole lot more people there than what the headlines claim. I don’t think we broke any records, but, you know, we had a 1000000 people in the audience probably. A million. And, yeah. Directly It’s

James Kademan [00:53:18]:
gotta be outdoors then.

Walter Kinzie [00:53:20]:
Yeah. It’s held on the National Mall on the steps of the Capitol. We build a big platform. The president is is out on this platform that’s, you know, 4 or 5 stories tall. You don’t really get that perspective on on TV, but it’s 4 or 5 stories tall. There’s a hierarchy of of the guests and where they’re at, and then ultimately, you have, you know, the National Mall where all the all the spectators watch it from. And there’s, you know, varying levels of production with speakers and LED walls and things like that. But then you also have all the other ceremonial stuff.

Walter Kinzie [00:53:51]:
So you have the the first dance. You have all the balls and different things like that that happen throughout the night. And, some someone wisely told me one time, you’re the sum total of all the decisions you’ve ever made in your life. And I and I when I heard that, it was just such a profound statement, for me. And and it could be a statement that if taken too literally, could be very stressful. Like, you you don’t wanna overanalyze these sorts of things. But it really you know, for the the the journey I went on when I heard that was I thought about, you know, what are the things that happened that ultimately led to what are the decisions I made that led to this particular thing happening in my life? And, and I I I went on that journey one time when I think about this inauguration that I planned in 2017. How did a farm boy from a little town of a few hundred people that was raised scooping manure and putting bailing hay.

Walter Kinzie [00:54:46]:
How did how did I land on the stage where I’m literally giving the cue for the transition of power to happen, and one president leaves office as another president goes? And I I was directing that moment in history. And and I went back and I thought about those decisions. And what I was able to come up with was I, you know, I got the call because I met someone at a house in East Texas. I met that person at that house in East Texas because I worked at a convention, much earlier and made a friend, and that friend introduced me to that person. I worked that convention because I made the decision in high school that I was gonna run to be a state FFA officer. And I ran, and I didn’t get it. And because I didn’t get it and I still wanted to be involved in FFA, I volunteered to go work at the national convention and making that decision to run for office, lose, and then still decide to be involved led me to work in this convention where I met this person. I got to the point where I decided to run for state office because I decided to run for district office as a junior in high school, and I had a really good experience.

Walter Kinzie [00:56:05]:
And I got to that point because I made a decision when I was a sophomore that I was gonna run for a chapter office, and I had a really good experience. And I got to that point because when I was a freshman in high school, I watched some kids that were chapter officers, and I thought, man, I’m gonna do that one day. I got there because when I was in the 7th grade, my older sister was an officer in this club, and I went to a banquet that she was being honored at. And she got an award, and I was just so impressed with what my sister did. And and then I made the decision that night I was gonna be involved in that same club. And earlier that day, I made the decision I was gonna go to the banquet. And a decision I made in 7th grade to go to a banquet led me to fall in love with an organization that I decided to be a leader in, that I decided to be a leader, and I failed at being a leader. So then I just got a volunteer gig that introduced me to someone, that introduced me to someone else, that introduced me to the president-elect of the United States of America.

Walter Kinzie [00:57:03]:
And I was standing there on a stage producing one of the greatest moments, in in history, and that’s not a political statement. That’s just, like, at the time

James Kademan [00:57:12]:
It’s a big deal. President of the US.

Walter Kinzie [00:57:14]:
58 times a person was sworn in to be the president of the United States, and I was calling the shots for one of those 58 times. And all because when I was in the 7th grade, I decided, you know, I’m not gonna watch TV today. I’m gonna go do this thing for my sister. Could have very easily just stayed home and rode a 4 wheeler on the farm or watch TV or whatever, and I would have missed all of that. And, and I also you know, there is I’m a I’m a god fearing man and Christian our Christian faith is very important to us and our family. And, you know, I think God empowers us to make those decisions in our life, and he presents those opportunities. And and sometimes he gives us really big nudges, and and sometimes he doesn’t. And, but it’s what we do with those nudges that that ultimately leads.

Walter Kinzie [00:58:00]:
And like I said, you can put a lot of pressure on yourself on on every single decision that you make, but that was a 25 year journey from one little decision I made in 7th grade, that led to this. And and and so I’ve had a lot of fun tracing back other decisions that’s led to other moments in my life that I’m just so grateful for.

James Kademan [00:58:20]:
That is man, that’s a cool story. Talk about the snowball effect.

Walter Kinzie [00:58:24]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [00:58:25]:
That is cool. And it’s not all in who you know. It’s who knows you. So just saying and interesting, even if you point out what you perceived as lack of success with you not winning FFA, imagine if you did win. Maybe you wouldn’t be doing that.

Walter Kinzie [00:58:42]:
Yeah. I mean, there’s a, there’s a, a great Chinese prophecy where, where it talks about all these different things. We’re like, oh, thank goodness. Like now you’re, you know, like the story goes something along the lines of, like, the kid gets bucked off a horse, and now he can’t be enlisted into the army so he doesn’t go to war. And, and they just kinda go along, you know, thank god that happened. And and the farmer always would come back and say, well, we’ll see. And you just never know. And and, you know, I’ve been I’ve been in business long enough.

Walter Kinzie [00:59:13]:
I’ve been at this thing called life long enough that I don’t have any control. All I can do is make the best decision in that moment that I think is gonna lead me in the right direction in that moment. But you don’t know how things are gonna end up. And if I’ve learned anything, it’s the great times are not gonna last. The really bad times are also not gonna last. And what’s on the other end of it is is a journey that you don’t know how it’s gonna go, but it’s gonna be alright. And and and and, you know, nothing is forever, and that’s okay. And I’ve had some really, really dark times in my career that it’s just impossible to dream about what that mountain could look like on the other side.

Walter Kinzie [00:59:58]:
It’s impossible to be able to conceptualize. Can I can I even get there? And, you know, you think about COVID was hard for the entire world. There’s not a human being I’ve met that was like, oh, that was a breeze. That was easy.

James Kademan [01:00:15]:
Let’s do that again.

Walter Kinzie [01:00:16]:
Let’s do that again. There that that never had that conversation. And and for me, though, there were tons of blessings within COVID, and and some of those blessings came by way of the complete decimation of my live events business. And

James Kademan [01:00:31]:
I imagine that took a hit.

Walter Kinzie [01:00:33]:
It was, you know, I didn’t lose anybody close to me to COVID. A lot of people I know got it. Certainly, you know, one degree, 2 degree, 3 degree separation between me and some folks that did not make it, but I didn’t have to deal with any of that. But I did deal with between live events that we had booked, live events that we contracts that we have with customers or events that we were actively running. I had 28 vans loading in South by Southwest the day the city pulled the permit on South by Southwest. Every one of those bands had been paid. Every one of those little wires that you talked about with your experience have been paid for, and it was just gone. And, you know, collectively, we had $40,000,000 in either live events that we were producing, live events that we had, in the works or contracts that we had secured that dissolved in 4 days.

Walter Kinzie [01:01:23]:
And I did not have $40,000,000, to

James Kademan [01:01:27]:
No. Not just whipping your wallet out and be like, was that 40? Okay.

Walter Kinzie [01:01:30]:
It was so it was just a it was a catastrophic time, and, we had a very interesting rebound that was not profitable, but it, but it was it was highly successful in the amount of joy throughout the world. We put early on, it was 300 or so venues together in United States and Canada, and we started doing drive in concert. So I put Garth Brooks, and he did a show to, you know, ultimately, 400,000 people that was able to stay in quarantine in their cars to go to a concert, you know, within 90 days of COVID hitting, and the whole world still shut down. We did one with Metallica. We did one with Bon Jovi, and we we did a bunch of these with a bunch of different artists. And, ultimately, the result was 1,700,000 people got to stay in quarantine at at a time when the entire country, the entire world was still shut down. We’ve got to leave their house and go do something in a social way that was that was unique and different. And, didn’t make any money doing it, but it was a very proud moment for me to to provide at least an ounce of hope and healing to a nation, multiple nations, during a during a pretty dark time.

Walter Kinzie [01:02:40]:
And and, you know, the team just did a a remarkable job. And so, you know, we’ve had a lot of those interesting moments that, that help help us get over that mountain one way or another. But, we had to ultimately, we’d run the company completely debt free since day 1, and we had to take on a bunch of debt, when all this happened. And, and frankly, we’re still working through the ramifications of that. It’s, it’s not been fun at all, but, but I still get to watch that artist walk up to the microphone and the crowd to go nuts. And, and that makes climbing these mountains worth it to me.

James Kademan [01:03:20]:
Fair. Totally fair. Walter, we don’t have a ton of time left, but I do wanna ask you a few more questions about the event thing. You do all this work. You get all the stuff going, and especially with some of the heavy metal band or probably any band, really. You hear stories about well, I guess I’ve even seen concerts where they showed up drunk Mhmm. Or stoned or something like that. And you’re like, man, I gave all this money to see this guy barely walk.

James Kademan [01:03:46]:
What’s going on here? How do you deal with that? Because you still gotta have the show go on. Yeah. Are there times when people just won’t get out of their dressing room or whatever?

Walter Kinzie [01:03:57]:
Yeah. You know, I’ve been very fortunate that, we’ve had very few cancellations, over the years. They do happen, you know, and life happens. A lot of times it has nothing to do with the artist, you know, overindulging or anything like that. You know, we had a situation a few years ago where the lead singer of a band’s mom passed away that morning. You know, we had that show booked for a year. There’s no way to predict that sort of stuff. And so things just happen, and you deal with them in the moment.

Walter Kinzie [01:04:22]:
Now that said, you know, you hear these horror stories about the way bands act and the way they carry themselves. Let me put it to you this way. You know, if you commit to doing a job for someone and you show up and they don’t have any of the stuff arranged that they said they’d have arranged for you, and it could be a simple office job and you get there and you’re expecting a laptop and you’re expecting, you know, paper and pencils and pens and, you know, maybe a a cold call list or something like that. You could show up and that stuff’s not there. You’ve been promised it. Now you’re showing up to do a job and you don’t have the tools to do it. How are you gonna perform and how are you gonna act in that moment? And, and so we we take them very seriously over communicating with with our bands every step of the way on what’s going to be there for them, what you know, and making sure they have what they need. So many of those moments are a direct result of not an artist overindulging, but but rather an artist showing up and the people that were in my position just didn’t do what they said they were gonna do.

Walter Kinzie [01:05:23]:
And and they’ve got a reputation on the line. Like, it’s you know, if a band has a bad night, no one’s thinking, oh my goodness. Walter Kinzie, that producer, he must have screwed something up. I don’t, I don’t deal with any of that. Band has a bad night. They’re the ones that have to deal with the ramifications online, on social media, all of that stuff. And so we take Barry serious that let’s do everything we can to make sure that when that artist shows up, everything is exactly the way it’s supposed to be, not just for the artist, but but every member of their team. They have the tools they need to do a good job, and that there’s no no one’s gonna be on fire trying to trying to figure something out.

Walter Kinzie [01:06:01]:
Everyone’s just gonna be super satisfied that everything is the way it is, and we can just have a nice relaxing evening. That approach has been wildly successful for us. And in that situation, we it is so rare that something happens. We had a a situation one time. We were it was a 40th birthday party, which so many of our things are birthday parties for kind of these ultra high net worth families. But it was a 40th birthday party, and, it was down in Georgia. And, family had a 130, 150 guests. And you think about that.

Walter Kinzie [01:06:33]:
Like, these people live a high profile lifestyle, but but an event like this, they’re putting their guard down in a very vulnerable position to give their fans or their friends and coworkers an ultra premium experience that kind of fits who they are. Like, I have to get into the mind of my clients to really understand their personality. So I’m not delivering Metallica to a to a Garth Brooks crowd, or I’m not delivering caviar to a cheeseburger crowd. You know? It’s so much of that stuff. And and so it’s a highly vulnerable moment for the consumer or for my client, and, and so we gotta make a lot of stuff go right. Well, this particular night, the artist had played 2 nights before over in Europe, and they were on a 12 or 13 hour international flight to get home and, you know, you’re sitting on a plane for 12, 13 hours. You only have so many things at your disposal, but an open bar at first class is one of them. And and frankly, they were just in no position to to do the job they need to do.

Walter Kinzie [01:07:34]:
But all of the fans are there. All the friends are there. You don’t turn 40 the next day. You turn 40 that day. You know, we got one shot to get it right, frankly. You know, we’re lucky that so many things did go right that night, but the concert portion of the evening did not. And that’s a heartbreaking thing, you know, and a lot of it, the the everyday guests that’s there, they don’t know how things are supposed to go. But my client and I, they’ve made the decision to spend all this money and divert all this energy that they could have been spending with their family or or building their business or whatever.

Walter Kinzie [01:08:09]:
They’ve started all this energy to have that ultra personal evening and for such a big moment of the evening to not go as planned. You know, it’s heartbreaking. And in that moment, you know, there’s there’s you don’t get a do over. And so, so it it just reinforce the need for us to just be ultra sensitive to every decision we’re making and and go above and beyond to create that experience. And that night, effective immediately, we no longer book bans that we’re gonna have to travel 15 hours by air to get to a gig. And and if we are, like, I’d as we worked in these other countries, now I put a day between when they travel and and when they’re gonna perform and I pay extra for that to happen so that, you know, they can get their head right, when they’re in the new country. So

James Kademan [01:08:58]:
So what happened at the birthday? Did you have to grab a guitar, or what happened there?

Walter Kinzie [01:09:02]:
So the artist went on stage. They played about 20 minutes of cover music. They played none of their hits. They fell off the front of the stage. And, and so I paid we had a we had a, a cover band that was closing the evening, and I just in a hurry went in and said, y’all are on the stage, not in 1 hour, but in one So get on there right now. I’m paying you extra money. By the way, I need you to play all of these hits that you probably never played before, but you need to figure it out because these were the songs the artist was supposed to play that they didn’t play. And then the next day, you know, it was, you know, canceled flights to hat in hand, go to the my my customer’s home and, hand them a great the gold check as a refund and and pray that I’d be able to work it out on the other end with the band that had messed up.

Walter Kinzie [01:09:51]:
And, you know, in some of these other situations, I’m very proud of the fact that in the very rare situation again, we’ve done we’ve done over 5,000 events. A lot of events, we have more than 1 artist on. And so, I don’t know how many artists I’ve actually booked, 6, 7,000 of them at this point. But, in the very rare situation, even, you know, in the case of that gentleman whose mother passed away same day, you know, I’ve been very fortunate. We’ve been able to get another band in place same day. I’ve never had a show just outright get canceled. And, and again, but that’s a readiness. That’s a preparedness.

Walter Kinzie [01:10:27]:
Like, that’s a I’m not necessarily going over with my customer. Okay. If x band goes away, we’re gonna pivot to train or Google dolls or something like that. But in the back of my mind, I know where I’m gonna go. And, and so we’ve you know, we always generally know who’s in the area, generally know who’s available. So if there is a significant cancellation, it could be like, hey. So and so can’t be here, but I know so and so is in the area. Can we get them over here? And, and it almost always works out that way.

Walter Kinzie [01:10:57]:
And so, and luckily, you know, I’m not the only person in the food chain that’s motivated to fix that problem. There’s a lot of people that are financially motivated for the those shows to go off without a hitch. So when those problems arise, very fortunately, there’s generally a small army of people that are highly incentivized to make sure that the problem gets fixed quickly.

James Kademan [01:11:17]:
So getting the phones, making it happen.

Walter Kinzie [01:11:19]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [01:11:20]:
The show must go on.

Walter Kinzie [01:11:21]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [01:11:22]:
Tell me And

Walter Kinzie [01:11:23]:
you know you’re in trouble when they’re not willing to answer their phone because they know that they’re out of options too. So that’s, when they can’t answer the phone, when they’re not answering the phone, they know that they don’t have any options to solve so they’re just not gonna deal with the mess at the moment. So Dang.

James Kademan [01:11:36]:
Walter, who was your what was the first band or event or any music player or whatever where it was you felt like this was above, like, oh, I landed something here.

Walter Kinzie [01:11:48]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [01:11:49]:
First one.

Walter Kinzie [01:11:50]:
First one. There have been

James Kademan [01:12:00]:
Yeah. Imagine there’s tears.

Walter Kinzie [01:12:01]:
There’s tears.

James Kademan [01:12:02]:
Right? You get the local. You’re like,

Walter Kinzie [01:12:04]:
oh, the school cover band

James Kademan [01:12:05]:
is pretty big. Yeah.

Walter Kinzie [01:12:06]:
Yeah. 1st major band I ever booked was a guy named David Lee Murphy. And a little dust on the bottle, great catch music singer that Oh,

James Kademan [01:12:12]:
yeah.

Walter Kinzie [01:12:12]:
I was like, okay. Oh, this is big time. Then, first time, one of my bands sold out a venue. We kinda we it was lightning in a bottle moment. We booked the band before they blew up. By the time the show happened, they they’d blown up. And so that was a big moment. That was a band called Cross Canadian Ragweed.

Walter Kinzie [01:12:27]:
Then, I did a private party. It’s the first time I’d done something across the $100,000 mark, and it was 4 or 5 bands working one party. But the party cost over a $100,000. It’s like, you know, that was more money than my parents made combined in a year by a long shot. And so the fact that someone would spend that much money. Next one for me was, first time a customer spent over $1,000,000 on one night. And it was just like, alright. We we got, like, a internationally famous superstar on the stage.

Walter Kinzie [01:13:02]:
And, and so that was pretty remarkable. The next level for me went went to a band called ZZ Top where Billy Gibbons is a great friend of mine now. Very fortunate for that friendship. And, but we booked them in 5 days. 5 days between when I hot called them and when they were playing. And that there’s a lot of street credit you have to have to be able to make a make a call like that. So that was wildly successful. Then I remember, the next level for me, I booked the Eagles for a private club.

James Kademan [01:13:35]:
Nice.

Walter Kinzie [01:13:36]:
And, you know, now you have one of the biggest, most successful rock bands in the history of music that have made the decision just like all those people in the crowd. Those, you know, Glenn Frey and Don Henley are gonna be at that thing that you’re putting together, and that was really, really big for me. And then kind of on that same level, but different. I I convinced George Strait to do a private party one time, and he doesn’t do, just can count on one hand the number of private parties he’s ever done in his life where he was paid to be there. And I had one of the first ones. And, and that was just a really big deal. It involved me, like, getting interviewed by him. And, so that was just a very surreal moment.

Walter Kinzie [01:14:21]:
And then, and then, and then for me doing, when I did a deal with Garth Brooks. And I’m not gonna go into all the details, of how it all happened, but, ultimately, I brokered the deal. It was me and Garth. There wasn’t attorneys or managers or agents or all these people. It was me and Garth working side by side, put a deal together, that that he would be at. And and the result of that evening was tens of 1,000,000 of dollars went to children’s charity and and a lot of really good things came from that evening. But it’s he and I working side by side and been very fortunate now we’ve done a lot of those things together. And, and and then, you know, you you layer in some of these milestone moments in history, like a presidential inauguration and things like that.

Walter Kinzie [01:15:10]:
And, I got to help produce the first, CFP college national championship game. And so some of those some of those moments that only happened one time, and and I got to be there for him was was, you know, I’m I’m pretty proud of. So that was, like, 15 answers to your question, but, but it’s, every one of them, there’s, I call it the war room, you know, because we all we all get together after it’s over and we’re like, can you believe that this and and we had to do this and we had to do that? You know, there’s there’s been moments where, you know, to solve a problem, it was like, okay. Where can I rent a 747? The Rolling Stones have one right now. Let me go rent this. Let me call the Rolling Stones and see if I can borrow their 747 real quick. And it’s just like all of these moments that have happened in my career was just like, are you kidding me? And I’ve just seen God’s hand in in in every step of this way. You know, and I’m, my products in the entertainment world, which is not all that different from the consumer package products world is, you know, I create that thing that creates a memory that hopefully is so profound and so positive that these people remember it for the rest of their lives.

Walter Kinzie [01:16:23]:
And and it doesn’t matter what business. I had a very smart guy tell me one time, you can run your business or your business can run you. I I’ve I’ve had those moments, where I’ve run my businesses, and I’ve had those moments where the businesses have run me and, and and my life is very different when I’m letting things run me. And so it’s, it’s just taking the steps and taking the time to do it the right way to run your business. And and then and it’s, you know, it’s also tough sometimes, particularly when you’re starting a business to separate yourself from it. So much of my identity was tied to this entertainment company. It’s who it is me. It is who I am, but, but nothing but stress and heartache comes from that even in the good times.

Walter Kinzie [01:17:07]:
So, it’s it’s finding that, and treating it almost like a plant that you you’re gonna plant the seed. You’re gonna pick the right soil. You’re gonna pick the right sunlight. You’re gonna pick the right moisture, and and hopefully, you grow that thing and and you gotta treat it that way. And when you do that, even in the good times or bad times, it’s very difficult to find or it’s very, easy to find joy. So I take that stuff pretty serious.

James Kademan [01:17:31]:
That’s awesome. Walter, I love it. Thank you so much for being on the show.

Walter Kinzie [01:17:36]:
Oh, thank you for having me. This was incredible. And I I don’t know how much time we spent here talking, but I’ve enjoyed every minute of it. And I can tell you right now, one of these one of these things I’ll I’ll tell you is is, you know that you’ve connected with someone that you admire when you just I feel like I could go another 3 or 4 hours with you easily. And and so for that, I thank you for that. I really appreciate it. Totally agree. Yeah.

Walter Kinzie [01:17:57]:
Thank

James Kademan [01:17:57]:
you so much. That’s it’s funny because I was like, so we normally do, whatever, 52 minute shows so that they can air on the radio. But it’s interesting because you end up talking with people just like yourself that have so much life experience. Like, we’re getting all this knowledge, this information, this experience. We can go another couple minutes. Right? So it’s

Walter Kinzie [01:18:18]:
That’s right. It’s Well, I appreciate it. It’s just been wonderful, and and I and, truthfully, I hope we get to do this again. This has just been a real honor for me.

James Kademan [01:18:26]:
Yeah. Absolutely. I wish you great success with, with Kinsey Foods.

Walter Kinzie [01:18:30]:
Thank you, sir.

James Kademan [01:18:31]:
And, I can tell you when you sell a business, that exit, I can tell you from my experience when I sold one of my businesses, that was one of the best days of my life.

Walter Kinzie [01:18:43]:
Oh, man. I was like Yeah. I can’t wait. I can’t wait. That’s, and there I don’t have, like, this this vision or goal of what it’s gonna be like. It’s just, it kinda goes back to that same notion of, you know, they chose to be there that night because of something I built. That’s that’s the satisfaction I’m looking for is, you know, someone decide they want something because of all the work that I put in to build it. And that point, it’s not about the price tag.

Walter Kinzie [01:19:12]:
It’s not about what it is. All that stuff’s gonna be gravy and and great. But, I just look forward to the satisfaction that I’ve built something that is that is so remarkable that that, there’s other groups that feel like they need it, and, and they want it. And, and so, god willing, we’ll have that experience one of these days. But, yeah, I I I’ll just tell you this last piece of I I one of my billionaire multiple times over billionaire clients sold 10 companies over a $1,000,000,000, each time. And, he told me, well, I asked him, I I said, when did you know that it was, it was time to sell? This was after he sold his first business for 3 or $4,000,000,000. And, and he said, there is no way. He said, I he said, I didn’t have this grand exit plan.

Walter Kinzie [01:19:57]:
I didn’t have this vision of how this would go. I woke up every single day, and I thought, what are the things I can do today that’s gonna put my family in the best position possible? And I’ve just been doing that, and I’ve done it every day for years years years. And one time someone came to me and they said, you know, what you’ve created here is worth this much. And, and we’d like to pay you that much money for it. And we thought, okay. It’s worth it for me. I’ll I’ll take that much. And and, and he was like, but we didn’t have this exit plan or this vision of it had to happen by this date or this time or for this much.

Walter Kinzie [01:20:34]:
None of that. Wake up every day and say, what can I do to put my family in the best position possible? And every decision I make every single day is around what can I do to put my family in the best position possible? And when you think about it that way, someday somebody’s gonna pay you so much for this thing that you can’t say no.

James Kademan [01:20:52]:
Fair. Fair. I love it. Walter, where can people find you?

Walter Kinzie [01:20:56]:
Kenzie foods.com. Kinzief0ods.com. We’re also, the handle, Kenzie Foods, on every single social media platform. I’d love for you to follow us on our journey. Check out the site, give us, even if you don’t buy anything, just give me feedback, info at Kenzie foods dot com. You got any advice, any thoughts, any Chris criticism, positivity, whatever you wanna bring, it’s all a gift to me. I look forward to hearing from you guys and, and just so grateful that that, you trust us to to even take a look.

James Kademan [01:21:30]:
Walter, I tell you, I’m excited, and I can imagine if I had Kinsey Foods. My I feel like the the big excitement would be when I’m at some park or something like that, then kids are eating their food, and I see somebody that I don’t know with a bottle of Kinsey Foods barbecue sauce. Yeah. I feel like that would be like, oh, yeah. That’s awesome.

Walter Kinzie [01:21:52]:
My my daytime version of that is when I see an order come in, and I’m like, wait. How do I know this person? Where did I find this for and then it’s like, oh, wait. I don’t. Like, they’ve interacted with somebody. They’ve interacted with somebody somewhere along the way, whether it was through our efforts or through a friend or whatever, and they just made the decision that something we’ve done along the way, they’ve they’ve committed to to go in. And and it’s just like, I’ve won this morning. I’m just like, there’s someone in California and have no idea where they found us, but they found us and they made the decision to spend money with us. And it just fires me up every time.

James Kademan [01:22:27]:
That that is totally fair. I get that as well. That is fantastic.

Walter Kinzie [01:22:31]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [01:22:32]:
Walter, thank you so much for being on the show.

Walter Kinzie [01:22:34]:
Thank you for having me. Again, I’ll do this as many times you want. I’m I’m so grateful for this experience.

James Kademan [01:22:39]:
I love it. This has been Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumph and successes of business owners across the land. My name is James Kademan, and Authentic Business Adventures is brought to you by Calls On Call, offering call answering services for service businesses across the country on the web at callsoncall.com. And of course, The Bold Business Book, a book for the entrepreneur in all of us, available wherever fine books are sold. If you’re listening to this on the web, if you could do us a huge favor, give us a big old thumbs up, subscribe, and, of course, share it with your entrepreneurial friends, especially those friends that love great barbecue sauce, which should be just about everybody, vegetarian or not. Right?

Walter Kinzie [01:23:22]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [01:23:22]:
As well as those that love to be entertained and need to understand exactly what’s going on in the back end, which as every entrepreneur, you always wanna know what’s going on in the back end. Right?

Walter Kinzie [01:23:32]:
That’s right.

James Kademan [01:23:34]:
Thank you. Walter, can you tell us that website one more time?

Walter Kinzie [01:23:37]:
Kinziefoods.com. K I N Z I E F O O D S dot com.

James Kademan [01:23:41]:
Excellent. We’d like to thank you, our wonderful listeners, as well as our guest, Walter Kinsey of Kinsey Foods. Past episodes can be found morning, noon, and night at the podcast link found at drawincustomers.com. Thank you for joining us. We will see you next week. I want you to stay awesome. And if you do nothing else, enjoy your business.