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Sean Ginsburg – Ginsburg Realty
Simple and Effective Advice: “Sales is never personal. I’m really gonna help them come to the decision that something needs to change within them because I’m here to help them achieve their targets.”
No one wants to be sold, but everyone loves to buy. The world needs salespeople, and as a business owner, you need to sell.
But what is the best sales strategy? How do you teach people that what you offer is what they need?
Sean Ginsburg is a real estate titan and sales trainer that has answers to those questions, and he shares them with us here. He unravels the intricacies of what it takes to be successful in sales. We delve into his journey from selling real estate to becoming a top-tier sales trainer. Sean discusses how he adopted and mastered Grant Cardone’s training programs and then redefined them to craft his own unique approach. He highlights the importance of discipline over mere motivation, the significance of matching personal goals with professional targets, and the critical differences between being a con man and a true sales professional.
Sean sheds light on the essential elements required for closing sales, especially in the B2B space, and reveals some of his bold strategies for calling out client objections. From managing sales teams to aligning company mission with individual motivations, this episode is packed with actionable advice for anyone looking to elevate their sales game.
Listen as Sean explains not only how to sell, but the philosophies of life that will help you reach the point of enlightenment to move beyond the sales process and into a great conversation.
Enjoy!
Visit Sean at: link.me/sean.ginsburg
Podcast Overview:
00:00 From Real Estate Sales to Teaching
09:37 Tony Robbins’ Time Management Critique
13:29 Aligning Company Mission with Employee Goals
20:10 Addressing Employee Concerns Respectfully
22:54 Right People, Right Seats
29:49 Mindset Shift Over Endless Events
37:21 Self-Reflection for Life Decisions
40:12 Class Time: Unexpected Problem Solving
44:15 Mindful Moments and Random Thoughts
52:08 Decision-Making and Problem-Solving Inquiry
54:34 Addressing Arbitrary Delays Tactfully
01:04:16 Misaddressed Email: “James the Huckster”
01:06:17 Identifying Self-Sabotage Patterns
01:10:53 Podcast Availability & Encouragement
Podcast Transcription:
Sean Ginsburg [00:00:00]:
If you don’t like something in your life, then fix it. You don’t like your job, go out there and do something different. In order to get different results, you gotta try something different, meaning you gotta change.
James [00:00:11]:
You have found Authentic business adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumphant successes of business owners across the land. Downloadable audio episodes can be found in the podcast link found at drawincustomers.com. We are locally underwritten by the Bank of Sun Prairie, Calls On call extraordinary answering service, as well as the BOLD business book. And today, we’re welcoming slash preparing to learn from Sean In of, SG Consulting. And I believe, Sean, we’re chatting about real estate, which is always a good time.
Sean Ginsburg [00:00:41]:
Real estate’s the best thing in the world, man.
James [00:00:43]:
How are you doing?
Sean Ginsburg [00:00:43]:
Thanks for having me on.
James [00:00:45]:
I love it. I love it. So let’s just start lay a foundation here. What is SG Consulting?
Sean Ginsburg [00:00:52]:
SG Consulting is where you come to for your On stop sales, handling objections, lead generation, prospecting, learning what it takes to close Calls, anything that you can think about sales is what we do. So whether you’re a brand new person that’s looking to start a business, whether you are have already started, but you’re looking to take your business to the next level, or you’re an advanced On, you know, we have everything when it comes we’re like a grocery store, but for salespeople.
James [00:01:24]:
Nice. Alright. So our Business is coming to you, or is this more an individual thing? Somebody’s selling cars and you’re like, I’m not selling any cars. I need help.
Sean Ginsburg [00:01:33]:
So we do individuals, but we also have, like, dynamic programs for bigger organizations so that we can come in and actually scale their sales teams.
James [00:01:43]:
Right on. And how did you get involved in essentially the sales training vertical?
Sean Ginsburg [00:01:49]:
Through real estate, actually. So
James [00:01:51]:
Alright.
Sean Ginsburg [00:01:52]:
I, I was, selling real estate as a real estate agent for a long time. For about 5 years, I was personally doing between 15 to 20,000,000 of personal production, and I got really bored doing it, to be honest. And, I found more, you know, fulfillment by teaching people how to go make 30, 40 grand per property. Right? So I I kept doing wholesale. I still do creative finance. I do all types of deals like that. I just don’t do much of the retail side of things anymore. So I was running offices with 200 real estate agents, and, one of my mentors had a program and it was basically to license his content and use that content inside of my brokerages The I was, that I was training.
Sean Ginsburg [00:02:38]:
And, so I’m a certified elite business coach with grant Cardone. So I’ve used his program to kind of leverage my own offer because I don’t have. You know, the giant training course while we’re building On out right now, but we didn’t have all of the sales process that we needed at the time. So I was using his content and then just training the agents based on that. And I’m like, wait a second. This is really working out. Why not just do this for all businesses? So we started doing home services because my dad’s a master plumber. My brother’s got a plumbing business as well.
Sean Ginsburg [00:03:09]:
We started doing, you know, HVAC, landscaping, electricians. I got 3 d printing companies. Just any business that really wanted to get to the next level, whether they had 4 salespeople or 400 salespeople. We were able to go in, you know, create a sales process that, you know, we can track, monitor, adjust, and align, you know, a step by step process for them to hit a specific target every single day, every single month, and every single year.
James [00:03:37]:
Alright. That is cool. So Grant Cardone, I’ve been a follower of his, not as religiously as I think a lot of people do. But I guess in the business world, there’s everybody’s got their gurus of choice. Sure. So how did you land on him versus I don’t know. Any just insert sales trainer here.
Sean Ginsburg [00:03:55]:
Oh, man. So well, that takes me back to the time when I just first got into sales. So, I mean, I went through everything, Sean. Everything. Jim Rohn was one of my favorites, you know, Brian Tracy, the Buffini, you know, OG Mandino, like, all of the greats. You know? Earl Nightingale, Napoleon Hill, all these guys, and I’m like, wow. Like, who’s the modern day version of these people?
James [00:04:23]:
Mhmm.
Sean Ginsburg [00:04:23]:
And grant’s it, man. I mean, I don’t I mean, there’s a lot of people that hate The. There’s a
James [00:04:30]:
lot of people that love
Sean Ginsburg [00:04:31]:
them, man. It’s either you hate them or you love them. So he took all The content and he made it The the in the modern day world. So I found him and I’m just like, dude, I relate with the guy. I like the guy. He’s doing a great job. Like, before I met him, I sound like him. So I was like, like, I just it was a perfect match.
Sean Ginsburg [00:04:51]:
So I started going to his events, just getting into his stuff. And, like, In was never this corporate, like like, handling objections and, like, no. It was always, like, me and my brother, like, calling my brother out on his BS. You know? Oh, nice. Always yeah. It was always me, like, talking to my sister, my mom, or or, like, my cousin. Like, come on, man. What are you talking about? Like, tell me the truth.
Sean Ginsburg [00:05:12]:
Come on, man. Like, real come on. What really happened? Right? Like, that type of style for me, that’s where I thrive versus trying to, like, put this, like, you know, I guess you could just call it the corporate, like, trying to save face. Like, no. No. No. Like, I had more fun with that style, and I I I I I figured that somebody else did it so I could, like, oh, wow. It was okay for me to go out there and, like, be myself and sell versus, like, trying to act like this corporate, like, amazing like, nah.
Sean Ginsburg [00:05:40]:
Screw that. Like, be yourself and help somebody make a decision. So that’s kinda how that’s kind of the story along how I found Grant and, why I ended up going with him. But I have multiple mentors. I have one other mentor that actually says, you know, The mentor is like following a cult. You know? You gotta have multiple mentors because you have to have a cabinet of people that help you, a cabinet of Adventures like the president has. So I have multiple Adventures, if you will, that helped me on very specific things.
James [00:06:10]:
Nice. You know, it’s interesting. I just read or I shouldn’t say I just read. I’m in The process of reading 2 books. 1 is In by Ray Dalio, and the other In, something on culture of the business, but I can’t think of it right now. But it’s interesting Sean these 2 books. Say it again.
Sean Ginsburg [00:06:32]:
Traction?
James [00:06:34]:
No. But, ironically, that book was recommended to me earlier today, and it was one of those, like, you know, I’ve had On that on my list for a long time. I should probably see. Yeah. I should probably I have read a book called Traction, but probably not the one you’re thinking of because the one that I read was not the one well, I thought I had the author here for Traction, but, because I believe there’s 2 books called Traction. There’s there’s probably more than that. But one In, like, the business book called traction, and I read this one that’s, like, BT In the business book called traction. Gotcha.
James [00:07:06]:
Anyways, yeah, I forget. It’s by someone woman that works in Silicon Valley The worked at Google and Apple and all this kind of stuff. Anyways, in the introduction of that book, she mentions Ray Dalio On principles and essentially says he’s wrong. And it’s just funny because I’m reading The Ray Dalio principles at the same time. I guess just different parts of the house. And it’s funny because it was it just reiterates what you’re saying The you need to have multiple mentors because there’s nothing set in stone, and no one knows that for sure this is the right answer. These are 2 successful people that are both saying literally opposing things.
Sean Ginsburg [00:07:46]:
So Right.
James [00:07:48]:
Kinda and they both sold, you know, bestseller, whatever. So you both or you get to read them, and then you get to decide which way you can go. So it’s all good. So I completely understand having multiple mem mentors. So you have more opinions, more guidance. Some of them are probably filling in cracks that the other one doesn’t even know they have. There’s different personality types, the Grant Cardones of the world. I mean, think of him versus Brian Tracy.
James [00:08:11]:
Brian Tracy’s, from my point of view, take a nap. And Grant Cardone is let’s get her done kinda thing.
Sean Ginsburg [00:08:18]:
So that’s his Exactly. Like Yeah. It’s huge. Brian Tracy is, like, more I would go to him for more self development in a sense, and it’s very much more Call, laid back, like, tone versus Grant In, like, dude, get out of your head and go take action, and you’ll get a result. The result’s either gonna be good or bad. If it’s bad, go change the task, and you’ll get a different result. Right? So it’s yeah. I mean, each person brings you something different, but, you know, I I I I like, Grant’s sales.
Sean Ginsburg [00:08:47]:
Right? Like, Jim Rohn was self development for me. Brian Tracy was, like, organization. Right? So each one of them had their purpose inside of, like, what I needed the most, like, John Maxwell, leadership. You know? If I wanna learn leadership, I’m going to John Maxwell. If I wanna learn sales, I’m going to GC. If I wanna learn organization, Brian Tracy is the best dude that I know.
James [00:09:12]:
Alright.
Sean Ginsburg [00:09:12]:
So it’s just kinda give the audience a little bit more of a thorough understanding of why I do that. Yeah. Because there’s people out there that choose 1 person. They’re like, that’s the On person. And I think that there’s a lot more you’re missing out on if you don’t have the opportunity to keep an open mind and hear from somebody else that may, you know, do the same thing, but specialize in something different that could give you more value in a different content, context.
James [00:09:37]:
Totally agree. Totally agree. I’m a big Tony Robbins guy, but from a time management thing, I feel like his time management thing is I’m not a fan. And when you go to his events, he starts The an hour and a half, 2 hours late. Whatever. Just like a concert, which is funny because I’m like, the irony here is that we’re wasting thousands of people’s time wasting. You’re still getting to chat with people that are attending, which is arguably better than the event itself. But it’s funny that I love him for all The stuff except for that one thing, so I gotta go find someone else that I like the way that they do the time planning thing.
James [00:10:12]:
So another thing Right. I don’t hold it against Tony. It’s just, like, you to expect The person to be everything to everybody is a very tall, unrealistic order.
Sean Ginsburg [00:10:23]:
Completely agree. 1000%.
James [00:10:25]:
Yeah. So tell me how you got the Grant Cardone stuff. You’re doing the sales. How do you go from using it to actually training and teaching other people how do you use it?
Sean Ginsburg [00:10:35]:
Master it. You gotta master the On. Like, I do a lot of jujitsu. I wrestled for 13 years. So I can do those moves in my sleep. I can do it unconsciously. Right? It just comes to me. It flows to me.
Sean Ginsburg [00:10:49]:
I know exactly what’s going to happen. I can bait people into trying to take me down because that’s what I want them to do, and I have a defense to it. It’s the same thing. So I got so good at using the material that just like Grant, how he repurposed all the content and made it his own. I did the same exact thing. So I took grants and James wrote all of this stuff, and I made it my own. And I internalized it, and I have my own way of presenting the material, if you will, and using it. So, you know, once you, like, level 1 white belt, like, once you kinda understand what you’re doing and, you know, you learn kinda you’re gonna get choked out for a long time.
Sean Ginsburg [00:11:29]:
You know, you get to the blue belt level where you can start to, like, do the moves and you start to really understand what you’re doing. Once you get to the purple belt level, now you’re like, you’re like getting dangerous. Right? All the way to a black belt level. Like, you’re so good at it. You’re you’ve mastered that stuff. Like, it’s it just comes to you. Objections. They’re just not objections.
Sean Ginsburg [00:11:49]:
They’re actually questions in the mind of the consumer that they’re willing to work with you if you answer them the right way. So I went from just using it every day on the consumer to then packaging that up and saying to the salesperson, listen. You’re missing out on sales because I was just like you. I can relate to, you know, the struggle and the frustration of you not closing a deal because you are going in The winging it. You’re going in their blinds. You don’t have qualified prospects. Right? Or on the next level, I’ve built sales teams, and the sales teams are not hitting KPIs. They’re not motivated.
Sean Ginsburg [00:12:25]:
They’re not holding themselves accountable. They have no personal professional financial targets in place to keep them motivated and accountable to hitting them. Right? So all of these little nuances, I just started to take note of, and I started to really understand if I solved all The for myself, there’s people out there right now that are struggling, killing themselves because they don’t know. They don’t have the knowledge or the wisdom to go out there and and and make more money by helping more people because they don’t have a process that they use every single time.
James [00:12:59]:
Fair. Totally fair. You raise an interesting point, and I wanna delve deeper into that if you don’t mind.
Sean Ginsburg [00:13:04]:
Sure.
James [00:13:04]:
So you’re managing teams and helping them do sales and all that kind of stuff. You mentioned the motivation thing. Can you detail how you would get people The have something to do all this for instead of just saying, do it for me. Do it for your job. Do it because we pay you to do that. That they have something outside In higher in themselves. How do you get people to believe or find a goal that they’re working towards?
Sean Ginsburg [00:13:29]:
So well, that goes to the well, 1st and foremost, the company. What is what are the what is the company’s mission? What this this gets In really typical, like, standard branding, like, who you are as a business, who you are as a company, what’s your mission, what’s your core value, what’s your what problems do you solve for people? Like, if you have clarity around the problem you solve for people and, like, why you do what you do, your mission statement will actually attract the people to your business that want to help build that mission with you. Right? You’re not just bringing on employees. That’s that’s you’re never going to get you you’ll you’ll bring on Draw apples that spoil the whole bunch. You know? One bad apple spoils the whole bunch. So it’s not necessarily motivation because motivation, you know, you get to a point where it’s nonsense. It’s actually discipline. Right? And if if you can align the person’s personal, professional, and financial goals with the companies and you know why they want to come work with for you and with you, you can they can hit their goals simultaneously by hitting your targets.
Sean Ginsburg [00:14:34]:
So you guys are working in this symbiotic relationship. But if you if the company’s mission and and core values don’t align with this person over here that wants to join, it’s like as a business owner, you have to make that decision to say, hey. You know what? It’s just not the right option for us. You know, maybe you could do well in this division over here, but for this position, it’s just not gonna work. We’re looking for The. Like, you guys gotta get clarity around, like, the positions that you’re hiring for. Like, for a salesperson, if I’m hiring a salesperson, they have to have that personality trait of, you know, like, grit grinding. Like, they they they gotta be willing to do whatever it takes to succeed because they’re going to get choked out.
Sean Ginsburg [00:15:17]:
They’re gonna get punched in the face. They’re gonna get arm barred and triangled over and over again until they understand and learn the game of sales, which is it takes a lot of rejection to learn the process that you need to go through and take somebody through to understand how to get a sale closed to help somebody make that decision that’s right for them. So it’s it’s really I think it starts with the company first and aligning what makes the most sense based off where they’re at. Like where’s the company want to go? In you’re at, you know, dollars 400,000 for the year and you’re trying to get to a million, like why. Getting to a $1,000,000. What will that do for you? Your team, your families, your your team’s families? Right? Because then at once you get to a point where you’re making so much money, it’s really you’re not making money for you. You’re now you have to keep this up. You’re playing not to lose because you’re you’re you’re you’re feeding families.
Sean Ginsburg [00:16:08]:
Like, look at some of these companies that have thousands of employees. Like, if they close the doors, they just, like, put a lot of people in duress. Like, what are they going to do? So I think motivation, I Call take it one step further. It’s not really motivation. It’s discipline. Holding them accountable to their targets, making sure as a, you know, as In owner, you know, why they’re The working with you. Because if not, you just have another number in your organization that will eventually kinda just die off and not really be helping you. And that’s becomes they’re they’re robbing you, or you’re robbing them.
Sean Ginsburg [00:16:45]:
You’re robbing them of their time. You’re robbing them of the responsibility of taking care of their families. Right? So you have to have that ethical moral obligation to really wanna help them, which in turn, they’re gonna wanna help themselves and help you as the business because you’re giving them the opportunity.
James [00:17:01]:
So let’s delve into that a little bit deeper. Because I’ll give you an example of one of the employees that I had. I was trying to connect to my employees’ motivations with the job like you’re talking about. And, one of my mentors, sales training using Sandler, said when you hire someone, find what they want and then help them understand how or if this job can help them achieve that goal that they’re after. And so I said, hey, Draw. What are top three of your personal goals? And most of the cruel crew was like, x, y, and z. Here it is. 1 of my crew In like, that’s none of your business.
James [00:17:43]:
And it took me aback because I thought, I don’t really care what your goal is. Right? I want to help you achieve your goal, but I’m I’m not gonna judge your goal and say like, hey. It’s a terrible goal. It’s none of my business really what your goal is. You say what your goal In, so we’re gonna help you achieve that goal. So what would you say to someone that was like, it’s none of your Business? An employee, I should say, In says it’s none of your business.
Sean Ginsburg [00:18:09]:
Sorry.
James [00:18:10]:
No. You’re good. Happen.
Sean Ginsburg [00:18:12]:
So what I would have done is, number 1, as the owner, that raises a huge red flag. Should’ve Huge red flag. Right? But I know I now know, like, you always applaud in public and you correct in private. Right? So, I mean, if were you in were you having, like, a sales meeting or something?
James [00:18:34]:
No. No. It was just an email.
Sean Ginsburg [00:18:37]:
Oh oh, it was a email.
James [00:18:38]:
Yeah. Oh, okay. Completely sent The email to everyone, so they could respond In, but it wasn’t no one else would see this besides just me.
Sean Ginsburg [00:18:49]:
I thought it was in the in, like, a large group setting, and I was like, wow. That person must have really had guts. Well, I now know that’s a red flag. I I would have actually wanted to have conversation with them. I would make it so that, you know, they came into the office or whatever, and we just have a 15 minute meeting because there’s something going on inside of their life that probably they needs attention and it’s probably affecting them professionally and financially because it’s personally something there. So that’s how I know that something’s not aligned with us and them. So I would have just taken them aside and say, listen. I’m here to support you.
Sean Ginsburg [00:19:28]:
Like, you may not think The. You may have some stuff going on, but what can I do to help? How can I support you? Right? We’re not babysitters, but at the end of the day, we are. Right? We’re Book babysitters. Yeah. We
James [00:19:41]:
don’t wanna be, but we are.
Sean Ginsburg [00:19:43]:
Right. We are. We’re we’re there to not sit there and feed them this this this this carrot. We’re there to show them how to get the carrot. And they’re you know, The taking full responsibility for everything in their life. That’s something I picked up from GC. Like, you have to take full responsibility for everything and anything that happens in your life, good or bad, or if it’s your fault or not your fault. Right? Because at some way, shape, or form, you created it.
Sean Ginsburg [00:20:09]:
Right?
James [00:20:09]:
Really?
Sean Ginsburg [00:20:10]:
So I would’ve just pulled The aside and really kinda do dove deep on the the what, like, what like, what’s going On? Like, I’m you work with The. Like, you don’t work for me. I work for you, and I create the opportunity for you to be here. I wanna make sure that I’m the right person bringing you the opportunity for you to hit your targets. So if you don’t mind me asking, what’s a little like, could you what do you mean by, like, it’s none of my business? Like, I would just I would straight up just, you know, call out the white or the purple elephant. Like, what what do you mean what do you mean when you say that? Did you talk to me a little bit more when you say that? Right? And then just see what they said and kinda take it from there and just keep it really nonemotional. Like, sales is never personal. It’s it’s always, I agree with everything you say, and I’m really gonna help them come to the decision that something needs to change within them because I’m here to help them achieve their targets.
Sean Ginsburg [00:21:03]:
And if I can’t do that, then obviously, it’s just not the right fit at that point.
James [00:21:09]:
I love that line that you said where they are not working for you, that you were working for them. I’ve been try I guess The line is one of those things where, like, I’ve been trying to reiterate something that essentially means that to my employees, but I Sean never figure out a concise way to say In. And that’s perfect. I love that.
Sean Ginsburg [00:21:28]:
I’m
James [00:21:29]:
glad. Excellent. That’s super Call. Because I tell the employees, like, my job is to keep you guys employed, keep you fed, because whatever it is that you’re spending with the money that I pay you, that’s on me to supply that. In exchange, you share with me your time. You do a good job. Rinse, repeat, all that jazz. But I don’t know.
James [00:21:49]:
It seems almost societally, there’s The saying where we hate Mondays. We love Fridays, and we hate bosses. And I’m like, I don’t know if that’s a I don’t know if any of those are good ideas. But Right.
Sean Ginsburg [00:22:01]:
I think well, that’s that’s the social norms, man. It’s like people are you know, they don’t like Mondays because they had a weekend. The weekend by the weekend. They’re going, oh, nice. Broken. They’re broken. They’re, oh, let’s go get wasted. Why you wanna get wasted? What do you wanna stop thinking about? Right? If you don’t like something in your life, then fix it.
Sean Ginsburg [00:22:23]:
You don’t like your job, go out there and do something different. In order to get different results, you gotta try something different. Meaning, you gotta change. Right? So I think, you know, a lot of bosses out there, you know, it’s like, they’re the boss. Do what I say. It’s like, you wouldn’t be the boss if you didn’t have people there to help you build what you’ve done. And, actually, Gary v does a really good job of that. You know, he’s he he will give the tickets to people and all that type of stuff to the games and you know, so I picked up some stuff from Gary too.
Sean Ginsburg [00:22:54]:
A lot of these people I pick up stuff from, but I think, like, you need people to scale and grow your business. And if you don’t find the right people, that’s when you don’t have the right people in the right seats. Jim Collins says it best. Like, you you have to find the people that are gonna fit The seats, like, fit on the bus and make sure that person driving the bus is the best person that’ll get you to the destination. If not, you kinda maybe have to change that up a little bit. But you’re right, man. A lot of people are going after that week and don’t go get weak on the weekends. Go Book, go find some stuff to do with your family, you know, stay up, you know, stay energetically high so that you can constantly get to work and hit and smash your targets.
Sean Ginsburg [00:23:38]:
Most people don’t have targets. They’re going to work. They’re, you know, sitting in traffic. They’re doing all this stuff to just make ends meet. And that’s what most business owners don’t understand. They’re not there to work for you. They’re there to help you grow your empire. And if you don’t see it that way, then you have some serious stuff that you should probably look at that could help you as In human help themselves, the the employees, get to where they wanna go.
Sean Ginsburg [00:24:04]:
So, ultimately, if you’re raising them up, they’re really gonna help raise you. It’s a buyback relationship.
James [00:24:10]:
Totally. Let me ask you the question that’s been asked about salespeople all over the world. Do you believe The salespeople are born or made? Made. Made. Made. Tell me why.
Sean Ginsburg [00:24:23]:
People are I James out of the womb on a closing table. No. They’re made. Like, maybe born as in every person who’s born is a great salesperson. Because as a baby, you, like, you sell your parents everything that you want. But in a sense, you’re The maid. You have to train, practice, role play, rehearse. Like, a baby does not know how to go close a $5,000,000 deal.
Sean Ginsburg [00:24:50]:
A baby does not know how to take somebody’s problem and turn it into a solution until you’ve practiced and learned and, you know, taught yourself how to do it. So I think they’re made because you need to understand your craft. It’s just like riding a bike. A baby don’t come out of the womb. You can’t put a baby on a bike and make sure it it’s gonna ride In and do some, you know, through, you know, 3 sixties on it. It’s impossible. No way. Right.
Sean Ginsburg [00:25:16]:
Right?
James [00:25:16]:
I love it.
Sean Ginsburg [00:25:17]:
So I think as an artist in jujitsu, for instance, like, I get choked out. I get tapped out. I didn’t come out a black belt. Like, I have to go earn that black belt. So, no, they are definitely made a 100%.
James [00:25:33]:
Tell me fair. I love it. Tell me about the people that come to your classes and your presentations and all that jazz. I imagine there’s some people that just pick up on it and other people that struggle a little bit, just like with any skill. So the ones that struggle a little bit, what do you do with them to help them move in the right direction?
Sean Ginsburg [00:25:52]:
So Call throw this out there right now. Most people out there that say all of their students all succeed, that is absolute nonsense BS. Okay? There’s people out there. You can lead them to the water. They will not you can lead a horse to water. The horse won’t drink the water. If the horse don’t drink the water, god can’t help that person. The you know, whatever you believe in.
Sean Ginsburg [00:26:15]:
So if the person’s not taking action, there’s nothing that we can do other than really ask them those deep, hard questions. And for anybody that’s listening, like, you gotta be willing to ask hard questions. And the only reason you won’t ask hard questions is because you’re either, a, afraid to lose the client, or, b, you haven’t asked yourself those hard questions. So sometimes you gotta do some internal work to, like, really be able to hold space to handle somebody in that in that time to be like, listen, man. Like, you joined this program because of a, b, c. Right now, There’s no commitment. You are not interested. Like you don’t On do this.
Sean Ginsburg [00:26:55]:
You’ve made this many phone calls and you’ve In, you’re getting choked out. You’re getting arm barred. You got bloody lip, man. You got black eye and you’re just like giving up, dude. But you what you don’t see is this is what’s preparing you for those $20,000 days. So, like, what’s stopping you from like, it’s really just The the conversation of, like, what’s really getting in the way? What are the barriers that are limiting you from where you wanna go? Right? And it’s it’s it’s most of the time, they’re just not they’re not sold on themselves. They’re not sold on the product. They’re not sold on why they do what they do or the problems they solve.
Sean Ginsburg [00:27:32]:
So it’s taking them back to, like, the root. Most people don’t get to the root. Right? And that In in James, in a sales call, they get to the objection, like, the close, and they get all these objections. It’s all surface level. You guys gotta dig deep under that that iceberg, man. There’s a lot of stuff that comes up. I’ve had people on closing calls that turns into this spiritual enlightenment talk where I’m talking for the next 40 minutes On, like, okay. And I’m just asking them questions.
Sean Ginsburg [00:27:59]:
You know? Right? So it’s it’s it’s more of getting personal with them, I guess, in a sense. Like, really putting them first and and trying to understand what’s gonna make the difference. Because I was I was there. I made 4 100, 500 calls a day. I was getting choked out and, you know, getting people rejected me all day. It sucks, and it’s not fun. It’s only fun when you know what it takes to get the deals and how long you’ve practiced and trained for that for somebody to take you serious. And until you get to that level, that skill level, it’s just it’s only gonna it you’re only gonna get beat up, but you gotta be willing to get beat up.
James [00:28:39]:
Right. I love it. You remind me of a story. I was at a Tony Robbins event. This is probably quite a few years ago. It’s definitely pre pandemic. And they had a little break, and I don’t remember if it was one of those 4 Draw, date with destiny, whatever it was. It was my second event.
James [00:28:56]:
And it’s interesting because I was talking to people just like you meet people and all this kind of stuff, and they’re like, this is my 5th event. This is my 7th event. This is my whatever. Usually a way bigger number than 2. And I was like, it’s just my sec. That’s right. I’m not not quite drinking the Kool Aid by the gallon or anything like that. Still great stuff.
James [00:29:17]:
Anyways, during one of the breaks, I see this woman that I actually saw at the last event that I was at probably 5 years ago. So I’m, and she’s sitting down and she’s looking In sad, kinda sulking in this kinda corner of this lobby of the conference center that we were at. So I’m like, hey. Are you okay? And we had a conversation for a couple In. She was just like, basically, I’m fine. I’m fine. I’m fine kind of thing. But, music was starting to come up and the people were starting to jump up and down, you know, crowded 10,000 people.
James [00:29:49]:
And I asked her, I’m like, how many times do you come to Sean In like this? And she’s like, oh, this is my 15th. And I’m like, 15th event of this you rah rah pump you up, get your growth mode 1000%. And she’s looking like she’s almost on the brink of suicide. I don’t think you need another event, man. I think you need a mindset shift that In this isn’t hasn’t done it in 15 times, you gotta find something else. In was very eye opening to think like, oh, I was treating this event Like, I’m feeling kinda a little bit lower. I should probably go to one of these events and get pumped up, take take my medicine kind of thing. But meeting her the second time in that mode, in that place of all the places, like, oh, it’s it’s all up here, man.
James [00:30:42]:
This is help. Right? The event is gonna help trigger that and all that James. Meeting these people is super great. But in the end, it’s all up here and On is on you. So that was really I mean, hopefully, she’s doing better now. I’m sure she is. But it’s one of those brought up a It’s cool meeting her, Sean her in that place to help me figure out, like, oh, this is what’s gotta happen here.
Sean Ginsburg [00:31:05]:
Right. And you brought up a huge point because most people, they’re called seminar junkies. Right?
James [00:31:10]:
That’s a thing?
Sean Ginsburg [00:31:12]:
Oh, yeah. I mean, think about it. A lot of people just go and do seminars because they are searching out here externally. It helps them it helps them get it helps them be distracted. They’re looking for the next thing, the next shiny object. Oh, it’s So I’m
James [00:31:30]:
gonna fix this thing back in On February or whenever I’m gonna go to this next event. I can kick my can down the road until that thing and then just rinse, repeat?
Sean Ginsburg [00:31:40]:
Yeah, man. And and it’s like, if if somebody, Book Proctor said it I mean, if somebody would just sit and listen and and and think about who they want to Book, right, and you have that clarity around, like, who that person looks like, what they do, how they do it, like, you’ll start to think about the actions and the tasks you gotta take. And most people just don’t take the action. Like, they’re just standing in their own way. It’s like, here’s the the the the end zone, and they’re, like, an inch from it, and they just won’t step into the end zone. It’s so hard. It’s so heavy. Just walk in.
Sean Ginsburg [00:32:20]:
Just walk right through the door. Just walk just just you spike the ball right in the end zone. You know? So it’s just taking that extra step. It it’s really believing in yourself. You know? And I I tell people On of the most hardest sales that I’ve made, and Grant talks about it too, is is my selling myself every day on why I do what I do. So I got expelled from high school, and my life was over, and I all star wrestler, lacrosse player. And I’m like, my life’s over. Like, I suck.
Sean Ginsburg [00:32:51]:
I’m an example. I’m a statistic. And then that was the hardest Call, to resell myself on the belief in me that I could go out and do whatever I wanted to do. This is my this is my chance, my opportunity to go show people. So what? This adversity, this setback, this is exactly what needed to happen, you know, for you to grow from this type of, you know, situation. Now maybe a young kid’s listening In don’t go get expelled. Right?
James [00:33:20]:
No. That’s not right. Like, this is The checklist of how to do it. Oh, get
Sean Ginsburg [00:33:24]:
expelled. Right.
James [00:33:25]:
So tell me really quick. You don’t have to go too deep in there if you don’t want to, but just what was the trigger for you? You get expelled, so you’re at this moment. Did so did a mentor come along, or did you watch a show, listen to a program, or were you smart enough to be like, wait a second. This is not the end. I have choices.
Sean Ginsburg [00:33:45]:
Well, I think I was smart enough because what I was surrounded by well, what you are surrounded by is what you’re influenced to do. So your environment is a huge factor, and it was like, after high school, I’m gonna go move out to California. I wasn’t going to college. I didn’t wanna go to college. My dad’s a master plumber, and I’m like, well, I can do The, or I can go try to do something and make something of myself before I just be a plumber. So, basically, after I got expelled, it was like, nope. You’re gonna stay home. You’re just gonna do this.
Sean Ginsburg [00:34:18]:
You’re gonna work. You’re gonna, you know, dig ditches. You’re gonna be a plumber. You’re gonna be, you know, the best plumber in this this city. You know, my dad’s great. He makes great money. Plumbers are awesome. I just I was like, yeah.
Sean Ginsburg [00:34:30]:
Dude, my knees hurt. My ankles hurt. My back hurts. Like, I’d rather let’s try something else first. And after that happened, I I just would sit and think to myself. And based off all the people I’m watching, I’m working in restaurants and selling cars and motorcycles, and I’m like, dude, this is not it. This is I don’t believe this. Like and the universe was like, dude, you can still go to California.
Sean Ginsburg [00:34:52]:
There’s no reason you don’t have to. Like, you’re not a failure. Like, failure is what makes success. Failure is what makes you better. You know, when you’re uncomfortable is where most growth happens. So I figured, do it anyway. Just move out. Just see what happens.
Sean Ginsburg [00:35:09]:
So it’s really just The realization. Like, you know, I used to go outside late at night and just think. I had wood I was surrounded by the woods.
James [00:35:16]:
Oh, nice.
Sean Ginsburg [00:35:17]:
See, like, in the in my restaurant I worked at, it was very fine dining, and I’d see the same guy 20 years behind the grill flipping burgers. And I’m like, dude, there’s there’s gotta be another way. Like, there this is that’s just not it. This is not. And every person I, Hey, should I move to California? Why you On move out there? That’s ridiculous. It just gave me the reassurance. That’s exactly what I should go do. Everybody else is selling me why they gave up on themselves and I’m going to sell myself on my dream.
Sean Ginsburg [00:35:46]:
This is exactly what I need to do. There’s something out there for me that I don’t know what it is, but I’m going to go figure it out. Even if I fail, at least I can say I did it. I tried and I learned and I had an experience.
James [00:35:59]:
I love The. That you remind me a little bit. None I mean, at a later stage in life. I was a mechanic for a long time In Authentic in Wisconsin. And if you don’t know Wisconsin, we get snow and salt and all that crap, and it gets stuck behind the the mud or in front of the mud flap of the tires. So you bring that car into a warm garage and you lift it up, Adventures, that snow and stuff like that comes down. And it doesn’t come down in pretty little flakes. It come down in huge chunks.
James [00:36:28]:
And I got this car raised up, and I’m changing oil or something like that, working on the car. And I walk underneath the car, underneath that mud flap, and I get this huge chunk that goes right down my Book. It was a snow, dirt, and Call. And I was like and I’m looking around, and I’m like, how long do I wanna be here? There’s a guy that’s been here 30 years. There’s a guy that’s been here 25 years. These other guys have been here 5, 10 years, whatever. I was the new guy after being there for a few years. And I’m like, I don’t think so.
James [00:37:00]:
Because you you look at them and you’re like, do I wanna be them? Is that because that’s that is your trajectory right now is that. And it’s really cool that all it took was that chunk of snow to be like, you know, I’m gonna find somewhere else to to do this where I’m not getting mud down my back and stuff like that.
Sean Ginsburg [00:37:20]:
Right.
James [00:37:21]:
So it’s interesting because I love working on Calls. Fun. Chatting with customers. Good times. But the little things where you just realized, I don’t wanna do this with my life. So but it wasn’t like I could go to someone and be like, what do you think I should do with my life? They’re gonna be like, you’re doing great at the mechanic, man. Rock and roll with that. So you had it’s like you were saying The you just had to reflect to yourself and think, what do I wanna do to figure out that step? Because no one’s gonna give you an answer that’s gonna be accurate except for you.
James [00:37:54]:
So and even that, you don’t know.
Sean Ginsburg [00:37:57]:
And the most people take, you know, other like, they like, Earl Nightingale said that opinions are the cheapest commodity on planet Earth.
James [00:38:05]:
Oh, I love that.
Sean Ginsburg [00:38:06]:
Most Most people take other people’s opinions for, you know, for what it’s worth. Like, most of the time, I’m externally searching or I ask somebody, what do you think about this? I’m listening to what they say, so I do the opposite.
James [00:38:23]:
Oh, interesting. Okay.
Sean Ginsburg [00:38:25]:
Because I know internally what the right answer is, but that’s a practice that the audience you guys should understand. Like, search within you. You are the universe. Right? So you have the On, and some of the people may be asking, like, well, how do I have that conversation? Who am I? What am I? Where am I going? What’s my life purpose? You constantly ask those questions. I promise you, you will get some place. You will get somewhere. You know, it’s kinda like, you go into the Authentic, and there’s, like, you know, little spiders and cobwebs and little rats. Just, you know, don’t worry about them.
Sean Ginsburg [00:39:03]:
They ain’t gonna hurt you. Clear them out. You know? Make a little nest for them. It’s all good. But sit there in the attic and think about those questions, and you will come up with some solutions. And those solutions is the actions you need to take. And then if you come up with that, your external world will be a 1,000 times different, but it starts with you. Starts with you.
Sean Ginsburg [00:39:24]:
It’s the biggest thing.
James [00:39:25]:
That’s totally, totally true. I used to joke with people business coaching clients that I had where I’m like, all I have to do is ask you a question that if you asked yourself, you could do this for free. You know, I’m just the trigger. Right? Because in the end, no one’s gonna ask themselves a question, and their brain’s gonna be like, I don’t know. I don’t know. Your brain will always come up with an answer. So sometimes the skill set is just asking a better question. So I love The, especially in silence when you’re not being bugged or your phone’s ringing off the hook or something of that nature.
Sean Ginsburg [00:39:59]:
And that the the trick is the trick is is to do it while you’re distracted. When you get really good, you can do it when other people are talking and yapping. There’s that’s when you’ve mastered it. Go ahead. Tell me what. Go ahead.
James [00:40:12]:
No. Is it well, I guess you allude to something interesting because I will sign up for classes, knowing that I’m semi interested in the thing, but more because I know that my phone will be off. I’ll be in a place where my employees aren’t bugging me. And while the instructor’s chatting, do teaching, doing their thing, I’ll end up daydreaming and solving a problem in either marketing or dealing with an employee or sales acquisition, whatever stuff like The. That if I didn’t give myself that time, I would never have gotten in that position, I guess, mental position to answer that question. So it’s so interesting that you’ll go to this class that’s probably like HR 101 or something like that. And you’re like, this is how we need to build the phone system in your head. It’s interesting how your your brain just works in those ways.
James [00:41:07]:
I don’t know what’s going on behind the scenes upstairs there, but
Sean Ginsburg [00:41:10]:
It’s the it’s the it’s the state of mind. It’s it’s you know The you’ve paid for that time for you to take the time to learn what it is that you need or what you wanted to learn. And it’s so funny that you say that because a lot of the times, you know, you go to the grocery store, for example, and you’re like, yeah. I I gotta get some toothpaste. And you walk out with tomatoes and rice and all this other stuff without the freaking toothpaste. Same thing. Right? So I always like to create a practice, like, a practice, a ritual, meditation, jujitsu, a sport, something that you can do every day to get in that state of mind. I forget who it was, but he would sit in his chair with his keys, and he would fall asleep.
Sean Ginsburg [00:41:57]:
And every time he fell asleep, the keys would drop and wake him up. And he would be in that I think it’s theta, the theta, frequency, and he would be able to come out with these crazy ideas. I I forget his name who was doing it. But there’s
James [00:42:13]:
real thing, not a TV show or something like that?
Sean Ginsburg [00:42:15]:
No. I’m dead serious. He would he would fall asleep in a chair in all blackness. He would tell his people, leave me alone. I will come up with an answer. Just don’t come in this room until I’ve come out. I forget who it is. You know, I have to look it up.
James [00:42:29]:
Like a CEO or something like that? Yeah. Here. I’ll look it up. I’ll look it up. Alright. There’s The, man. I just learned oh, I guess The was in that other other, culture book that I was reading, the one that opposed the principal’s book. They’re talking about a guy that was CEO that would sit every 2 hours, schedule time every single day, and that was a permanent meeting.
James [00:42:56]:
Don’t schedule anything over this kind of thing. And that’s where he came up with all the ideas to do the things with the company and all that kind of stuff. But I guess he treated it like, I suppose oh, let’s The. What’s the blood transfusion type thing that you have to do? If you don’t do that, you die kinda thing In your your kidneys shut down. I wanna say transfer.
Sean Ginsburg [00:43:19]:
I don’t know. So it was Salvador Calls, but it was also, Thomas Thomas, Edison did it as Call. But Salvador it says while the so a surrealist painter would hold a key above a metal plate, and as he drifted off to sleep, the key would fall and clang against the plate, waking him up as just he was entering the hip and not at a jig state. A phase between wakefulness and sleep where vivid imagery can occur, potentially sparking creative insights.
James [00:43:50]:
Oh, so now he’s a artist. Right?
Sean Ginsburg [00:43:53]:
Uh-huh. But there’s also CEO. There’s there’s there’s oh, man. I I after this, it’s gonna come to me after The. No.
James [00:44:01]:
I’m putting you on the spot. It’s all good. Yeah. All good. That is interesting. I’ll have to try that. I’ll have to tell my employees, don’t bug me until you hit metal clang and my keys falling. That is
Sean Ginsburg [00:44:15]:
Well, I mean, it could just be a meditation that you sit for 5, 10 minutes, Sean, or, like, you go on a run and you’re thinking about summer. You just go ahead and take a walk in nature. I love being by the water. I live by the ocean. Cold water is amazing for me. When I’m doing jujitsu, I’m always, you know, solving problems in my head and, you know, all of a sudden, I’ll go write something out on my phone real quick. Right when I wake up, sometimes In the middle of the night, I’m always thinking about, you know, weird stuff that doesn’t make sense right then and there, but I write it down anyways. And then during the waking hours, I’m like, oh my god.
Sean Ginsburg [00:44:48]:
I can fit that piece of the puzzle right here. You know? And it just it just happens. Right? But you gotta be conscious to those coming to you. Right?
James [00:44:57]:
I completely understand that. Having the the notepad by my bed has been one of those things where just, like, what was my brain doing that that came to mind? You write it down The next morning. You’re like, that makes total sense now. Or you’re ready down, you’re, like, half asleep. Put it down. That is cool. I love it.
Sean Ginsburg [00:45:16]:
Right.
James [00:45:17]:
So, Sean, the the people that you’re working with, are they typically real estate? Are you offering sales training to everyone?
Sean Ginsburg [00:45:25]:
So my ideal client, is real estate agents, brokers, or teams. I’ve actually just transitioned into home services. We have if if you I have SaaS companies. Basically, whatever service or product you have, if you’re selling something, I can work with you so long as you have a sales team and a somewhat of a process. If you have none of that, I can build it. But if you’re starting from scratch, you In of just have to The it’s just basic sales training at that point. But for, like, a home service company that has 5 trucks on the road, I know what problems you’re having. I know your people aren’t following up.
Sean Ginsburg [00:46:08]:
I know that you guys are sending out bids every single month and you’re not getting them approved. You’re not getting them signed on. Right? As a SaaS company, I know you’re presenting products. A lot of the people are analytical. They’re spending way too much time on those calls. Right. And they’re not closing deals. Like there’s so many little nuances In the sales process that if you just cut a lot of the stuff out and tighten it up, there’s so much more time in the day to help more people and close more deals.
Sean Ginsburg [00:46:33]:
So the reason real estate’s ideal is because I know real estate better than anything ever. So if you’re talking to me about how to Sean some SAS company for a pharmaceutical industry, it’s like, I can give you all of the data, but but you’re gonna have to take the data and then insert your product into the data, which, obviously, we have programs where we customize In, and I’d have to take a look at the sales process, the product, the service, and do it myself. But, ultimately, yeah, any any business, man. It’s like like I said, we’re like a we’re like a Walmart for sales organizations.
James [00:47:09]:
Nice. So is it just you doing the training, or do you have a team?
Sean Ginsburg [00:47:14]:
So right now, it’s me. I have a sales team of 10 people, and, I’m actually training somebody right now who’s gone through my training, built their own sales team, and knows the content like I do. So we’re actually implementing a mastermind where he’ll do it maybe 2 or 3 days a week, and I’ll do it the rest of the time. But mainly, it’s just me right now.
James [00:47:39]:
Alright. And the majority of your training, is it remote or is it in person?
Sean Ginsburg [00:47:45]:
So it depends on what program they choose, obviously. Yes. There’s options for me to come in person, fly out there, do sales workshops, sales meetings, a 1000%. Mainly, most of it is all online, all remote.
James [00:47:59]:
Okay. And is this a On shot, one kill kind of thing where you go for a day, train, train, train, and then you’re out? Or is this a residual every week, every month, every quarter, something like that?
Sean Ginsburg [00:48:11]:
So the way that I would customize it, it’s gotta be ongoing. Remember, you’re like going to the gym. If you go to the gym one time for 1 hour and never go again, you will definitely not have a 6 pack.
James [00:48:22]:
Yeah. I did my push ups.
Sean Ginsburg [00:48:24]:
That’s what I’m saying. You you gotta constantly be training every day. So we have, you know, protocols to have this every single day. We have systems out there In courses where it’s every day. We can track, monitor, and actually see the numbers that the salespeople are putting in. We can see how much and how long they’ve trained. But most importantly, the weekly or biweekly or quarterly calls with On of the coaches, one myself or some of the people that I have training with me right now, Those are the most important because it’s like the trainer in the gym actually showing you how to lift that weight and do it the right way with the right form.
James [00:49:03]:
Got it. Makes total sense. Call me, On a shift, we don’t have a ton of time, but I wanna ask about b to b sales. I hear a lot of stuff about selling b to b, and they’re just like, The are people and all this kind of stuff. But the decision making process, at least from my point of view, has been much longer, because b to c is typically a salesperson to a person that’s got the wallet, checkbook, credit card, whatever. Where b to b, there’s multiple decision makers. So tell me how you work the sales training with b to b sales specifically.
Sean Ginsburg [00:49:42]:
So are you saying close the deal or how, The process? Deal. Oh, okay. So, well, there are several requirements to closing the sale. So if any one of the 7 are out, then you will not close the sale. So the first and foremost, number 1 In the reseller requirements On closing the sale is you have to have all decision makers present on that call. Because if not, and there’s 4 decision makers in this organization and you have one on the call, that’s their way out because they cannot make the decision literally. So it’s always having the, the decision maker’s present. They have to have the wherewithal.
Sean Ginsburg [00:50:20]:
Like, the company has to be doing enough revenue for them to be able to pay you the exchange. The critical exchange point is when somebody gives you the money for the value you’re providing. Right? So the decision maker, the wherewithal, they need to be sold on the product. They need to be sold on you, the company, like the salesperson. They need to have the confidence in the product. They need to have a written offer, like a proposal, and they have to have the urgency to buy. I can’t tell you how many times when I was really mastering this that I did not have somebody that has the urgency. They had I had the decision makers.
Sean Ginsburg [00:50:54]:
They had the money. They just they didn’t have a time frame on when they wanted it. It was just like you’re trying to you’re trying to beat a dead horse. Like, they will not close. Right? So if all those are in place, you can really speed up the sales process. But most salespeople are just trying to get the The deal, and they don’t understand that 2% of sales take place on the 1st contact and 80% take place between the 5th In the 12th contact. So if you just stuck in the game for a little longer, you’d probably would have gotten the deal. And then this brings me to the next point.
Sean Ginsburg [00:51:28]:
No one thing blows a deal. I learned this from Cardone. When I learned this, The game changed for me because I wasn’t afraid to push to lose the deal. Remember, the only reason you are afraid to lose the deal is because your pipeline is not big enough. You’re not talking to enough people. So I ask hard questions on that call always. If they’re not willing to answer my hard questions, it’s not a real deal. I’d rather find out that it’s not a real deal now versus 2 weeks into this process and then find out that they’re not On to do the deal.
Sean Ginsburg [00:52:01]:
Right.
James [00:52:02]:
You got hours invested and yeah. Waste of time. Tell me about the questions, the hard questions.
Sean Ginsburg [00:52:08]:
Well, I mean, other than yourself, who would be in charge of making decisions for the company? Why would you wanna do this now? Why not 6 months ago? Why not 6 months from now? Why are you taking the time to take a look at this with me today? What’s the number one biggest challenge that you guys are having where if I had a magic wand and I snap my fingers and made that problem disappear? Like, what what is that thing? If I made it disappear today, are you guys real ready, willing, and able to take action right now? What’s this costing you per month for not having this problem solved? Right? And then there’s stuff that, a lot of The stuff that comes up, like, I know I’m on the spot. Like, like, they just won’t give you answers. So amateurs ask questions, professionals get answers, professionals get results. So if they’re not like, what’s the revenue of the business? That’s none of your business. Right? Well, listen. Allow me to be a professional. In order for me to see if I can help you, allow me to, you know, put my finger on the pulse so that I can take your heart rate. Like, if you went to a doctor and you wanted your you had heart problems and you wouldn’t let me check your pulse, I would not be able to professionally diagnose you.
Sean Ginsburg [00:53:13]:
So allow me to be a professional. Right? Like, that’s a hard conversation if you’ve never had it because it’s uncomfortable. But you don’t go into a doc, so I I really like to train people. Like, you put your white lab coat on, and you take your stethoscope, and you start, you know, figuring out where their pain is. What’s the pain? Where does it hurt? How does it hurt? Is it burning? Right? Is it hot? Is it sharp? Right? And if they’re not willing to answer those questions, I cannot diagnose the problem effectively, meaning I’m just a con man. I’m just another salesperson looking for a deal. That’s not why I’m in the business. Right? So one of my mentors back when I was selling real estate this is a great one.
Sean Ginsburg [00:53:56]:
There’s one difference between a con man and a sales professional. You know what it is? Intention. The con man wants what’s best for the con man. The sales professional wants what’s best for the client. So if you just put the client’s yeah. If you just put the client’s needs first and you are asking them the questions that no other company or salesperson’s asking, they’ll respect you more. They’ll trust you more and really give you the information you need in order to help solve the problem for them to take you serious to give you the money so that you can start working.
James [00:54:34]:
Nice. I love it. Let me ask you about the out of those 7, the urgency On kinda stuck in my brain because that I can see I was just joking about someone The, last month because we’ll be talking to people, potential leads, or potential clients, and all that jazz. And they’ll say, like, you know, we’re gonna look at this after Thanksgiving, after Christmas, after New Year’s, after second full moon, after unicorn passes, whatever. They always make up some I shouldn’t even say they make up. They use some arbitrary date or event that has nothing to do with what we’re talking about to say, like, we’re gonna look at this after that. So how do you address things like that that I guess you could call objectives?
Sean Ginsburg [00:55:21]:
Calling them out on their BOLD their BS.
James [00:55:24]:
You know?
Sean Ginsburg [00:55:24]:
They’re, you just like, if you okay. So in the sales process, you greet, fact find, demo, close, follow-up. You greet, you put the buyer at ease. Fact find is you’re qualifying them. And in the qualification, if you’ve done a good enough job in fact finding, you’ll know that was you’ll know the answers because you should ask them how long have you been experiencing this pain? Like, how long have you been experiencing this problem? Oh, for the last 3 years. So when I close on them and ask them for the appointment or the money, and they’re like, oh, we’re gonna wait till after January. Dude, you’ve been waiting for the last 3 years, man. Come on, man.
Sean Ginsburg [00:56:01]:
Let’s do this. Like, I have the permission to now call them out on that. Right? So if you do a if you do a deep enough job in your qualification Sean you’re asking those paint like, you don’t wanna be a machine gun, I tell people. You wanna be a sniper. Like, sniper bang. Because the questions you ask will be able to show them that you understand The you really can help them and that they need the help, and they need to help themselves now. So, you know, we’re gonna wait till this time. If I already know in the qualifying questions that listen.
Sean Ginsburg [00:56:38]:
They’ve been experiencing this problem for the last, you know, 6 months. It’s costing them you know, what’s one deal worth to you? 25 grand. Okay. How many deals are you missing On The? Because this problem’s not solved right now. Probably 5 a month. 5 times 25 is a 125,000 a month. Dude, that’s over, you know, $1,000,000 this year, dude. Like
James [00:57:00]:
Yeah. You wanna wait for a month for a $1,000,000?
Sean Ginsburg [00:57:03]:
If if you don’t wanna do this for The another 6 months from now, listen, man. It’s gonna cost you a little over Draw. Like, that’s what I’m saying. You get to you get to use the information in fact finding to show them too. There ain’t no more time to wait, man. You wanna do this or not? So you’re leading the client up to On single point of decision. So you’re, you know, with a great presentation, the close comes naturally. And, you know, you can always get into once you get to that point, they’re like, no.
Sean Ginsburg [00:57:33]:
No. No. And they still don’t wanna do it. That’s when you’re like, look, man. What are you scared of? There it’s probably the money. They probably invested into something that didn’t work, and you kinda just have to, like, clear them from you have to control alt delete their last experience. You have to help walk them through In, and you have to have the conviction, the credibility, and the confidence and showing them that that’s not gonna be like the last experience they had and, you know, make them make the decision themselves because you’re not really selling them anything. They’re selling themselves on why it would be the best opportunity for them to move forward with you.
James [00:58:07]:
I love that question. What are you scared of? That’s a that’s a ballsy question to ask, but a very productive one.
Sean Ginsburg [00:58:14]:
Or you I mean, I’ve even I mean, I know we’re live, but I mean hey. You think I’m full of don’t you? Right? Like, no. No. No. No. Absolutely not. Okay, man. Well, what what what’s stopping what are you scared of? That will separate the the the average from the the great salespeople because, remember, no one thing blows a deal.
Sean Ginsburg [00:58:35]:
If they’re serious, they’re going to tell you why. Because there’s 4 categories of objections. There’s the price, a stall, the timing, or the money, or there could technically be the unspoken. And if they’re giving you an unspoken objection, it’s the most dangerous, Meaning, they’re not telling you why they’re not moving forward. So you have to suggest why they’re not moving forward. Meaning, hey, man. Why like, what are you scared of? I’m not scared, man. It’s just it’s just the money.
Sean Ginsburg [00:59:02]:
Boom. When you get down to the okay. Oh, what what do you mean by that? I just don’t have it, man. I just don’t have. No problem, man. Like, if but if it wasn’t for the money, Call, like, if this was free, you do it. Yeah. Dude, it makes it so easy, man.
Sean Ginsburg [00:59:16]:
I got a payment plan. Let’s do a 2 pay option. Would that help you? Don’t lower the price. Like, don’t like, most objections are just complaints, and they should be treated as reasons to close. Right? Period. So and it’s just you have fun with it. You smile and just have fun and keep it light, and you’re just helping that person make the decision. If you believe in yourself, your company, and why you do what you do, I promise you The person needs to act with you.
Sean Ginsburg [00:59:41]:
Because if they don’t, they’re gonna go spend it on Netflix, alcohol, drugs, or whatever they’re gonna Draw, or somebody of your competition The, you know, you can do it better. So you might as well help them make the decision now for you to help them in their business and The their life, make more money, help more people, sell more product, whatever it is that they’re doing.
James [01:00:01]:
Fair. I love it. I got 2 more questions for you here, Sean. Do you have a favorite sales movie?
Sean Ginsburg [01:00:10]:
Favorite sales movie? I love The Big Short, man. I love The Big Short.
James [01:00:14]:
It’s a fantastic movie.
Sean Ginsburg [01:00:17]:
Yeah. I really like the big short. I really do love that one.
James [01:00:20]:
I guess I never thought of that as a sales movie, but in the end, kind of The.
Sean Ginsburg [01:00:25]:
Well well, because you see, it’s not necessarily sales, but, like, you see how they were selling us, like, the the Customers. And you can see, like, how bad and and dark it could be. So it’s like, it shows you how to sell yourself On. Like, dude, you have to be moral, ethical, and responsible in this game of Calls. Because if not, look how bad it gets, and look Book it just gets ugly. Like, you don’t wanna not sleep at night. But you I learned so much just from watching that movie because, like, I would never do that. Like, I was in the real estate business.
Sean Ginsburg [01:00:58]:
I know lenders, and there’s people that would want to do business with me. And I just the way they talk, the way they act, and I was just like, hey, man. It’s just not the right fit. Right? So I’d say the big short. Yeah.
James [01:01:09]:
Alright. That’s cool. Next one is in my world and in just about every other salesperson that I know, at some point, they have been called shyster, huckster, smoosier schmoozer? What does my wife always say? She’s like, you’re gonna go schmoozing tonight when you’re gonna go some networking event or something like The? I’m gonna go I’m gonna hang out with sharks. Stuff like that. How do you feel when somebody says something like that to you?
Sean Ginsburg [01:01:40]:
I don’t care.
James [01:01:41]:
Alright.
Sean Ginsburg [01:01:41]:
Because I
James [01:01:42]:
love it.
Sean Ginsburg [01:01:42]:
Because we because that’s how they feel about themselves.
James [01:01:47]:
Oh, true story.
Sean Ginsburg [01:01:48]:
Because they’re sell because they’re selling themselves short on why they can’t get in the same rooms and make the same amount of money, if not more, and become the best human being they possibly become. So if that triggers you, remember your internal world is a direct reflection of your external world. So if you believe that you’re there, you’re either selling or you’re being sold and you need to stay sold In what Grant Cardone says. So if you sell yourself
James [01:02:13]:
Say it again. Stay sold?
Sean Ginsburg [01:02:16]:
Call or be sold and stay sold.
James [01:02:19]:
Okay.
Sean Ginsburg [01:02:19]:
You need to stay sold on your product, who you are as a person, who you are as a business, all of those things. So if you believe that you’re a shyster or you’re a washed up salesperson or you’re just trying to get to the next deal, when somebody says that, you’re gonna take it to heart. You’re gonna take it personal, which that’s how you know you need some do you gotta do some work. You have to go back and sell yourself on dude. I’m a great salesperson. You know, I’m an ethical, moral person. That’s going to help somebody make decisions. I have a product The people will love because it’s going to change their lives because of this, this, this, this, and that.
Sean Ginsburg [01:02:54]:
I know my stuff is so good that it changed my life. I promise and guarantee it’ll change somebody else’s. In know that because I’ve done In. I’ve experienced it. Right. So whatever going on in here is directly out there. So make sure you’re good with you in here. And out here, you’ll start to see a direct reflection because it’s all a mirror.
Sean Ginsburg [01:03:16]:
It’s all a mirror.
James [01:03:17]:
Fair. Holy fair. I asked because this is quite a few years ago. I was trying to sell a truck, Not a used car lot or anything, just the truck that I had. And this, group of 3 people came to me. It was a husband, wife, and then a sister of the wife. Parents had passed away, left The a farm, and they needed to buy a truck. It’s those little Nissan On thing, a lot of Calls, kinda beat up.
James [01:03:42]:
And I met them at a parking lot of a place that I was going to teach a business planning class. And so I didn’t have a whole lot of time. So, anyways, I asked them, who is paying for this? And they all looked at each other like, well, we don’t we don’t really know who’s paying for this. So I was like, well, this sale is not gonna happen because nobody know who’s who’s gonna pay for the The. So I gotta go teach this class. Anyways, I left In my card, and I’m like, you chatted over. You figure it out. And then if you’re interested, give me a call, shoot me an email, whatever.
James [01:04:16]:
Anyways, one of the people I don’t forget if it was The sister or the wife, emails me, but she intended to email the other person saying this James guy’s little huckster. And I had to look up the word huckster because I’d I’m like, I don’t even know what that means. But it was funny because whatever it means where it’s essentially not a very high level sales or not a very, ethical salesperson, I guess, is what you would call it. And I was thinking like, man, that’s kind of insulting because I didn’t even try to sell them. I thought there’s no way this is being sold to you guys. So I In just left. I gotta go teach my Call. But it’s so interesting because then I respond back Call, I think you sent this to the wrong person.
James [01:05:00]:
And it was just one of those like, I didn’t feel like I was doing anything wrong and wasn’t planning on selling In the vehicle until they figured out. I even told them I’m like, if you guys want because this is a little farm at their parents left them. I said, if you guys want, come to the business planning class that I have going on right now. There’s no cost. It’s for this nonprofit that I was working with. Just and map out your business plan of whatever you’re gonna do with this format thing because it sounds like there’s a lot of answers and questions that you don’t even know where to begin. So it’s just In funny that, to be called that and like, man, I don’t even know what I could have done to leave that, that accusation. But in the end, it’s like, whatever.
James [01:05:45]:
Good luck.
Sean Ginsburg [01:05:45]:
Well, so a lot of well, that that’s glad that you brought it up because the other person is probably lying, cheating, and stealing from themselves. Right? And that’s something that most people get the opinions again. It goes back to the the opinions of the cheapest commodity on earth. Right? So what people what somebody like, and I I I can vouch for this. I try to do this practice where I’m not enlightened. Everybody else is enlightened. Everybody else is Jesus, god, and Buddha, whatever. Everyone’s enlightened but me.
Sean Ginsburg [01:06:17]:
And the more that I get told something from someone, I’m like, I get to see what’s going on. Right? It’s a really good practice. And the reason I bring it up is because if if, like, where else is that showing up in your life? Is there something you robbed yourself of that day that you should have done? Did you not do the laundry and tell yourself that you were gonna do it and you lied to yourself and didn’t keep your word? Right? Did you not make your bed and you knew you shouldn’t have made it? Right? Did you tell your kids that you were taking them out The ice cream and then never did it? Right? So, like, where else is that thing showing up? Because if you can’t figure that piece out, it’s gonna keep showing up out here. And until you like, the universe is like, dude, come on, man. Like, we’re gonna keep doing this on repeat until you, you know, until you get it. Right? Yeah. So it’s and it’s great too. But if you Call just put that in perspective, most of the listeners, like, if you can just put what people say to you are typically projections of The own their own selves.
Sean Ginsburg [01:07:15]:
And if you feel like that’s you, then that’s something you need to heal In inside of you. You gotta give it attention. That’s why I gotta take full responsibility for everything. Good, bad, not your fault, your fault, everything. Because if you take responsibility for them saying it, then there’s like, you are not the victim no more. And victim is the lowest level of consciousness. Right? You’re, you’re, you’re, you’re beyond that. It’s now, how can I solve the challenge of me feeling that way? And now you like clear that out.
Sean Ginsburg [01:07:45]:
Now you can be this new person that, that that you’re not affected by that. Now you have new space to bring In new thoughts for new opportunity and new scenarios and situations.
James [01:07:54]:
I love it. I love it. That’s you raised Sean interesting point because I think about my kid, when somebody calls a name. And I said, if some some kid called you stupid, what would you think? And then he tells me The reaction. I said, what if somebody called you a lamppost? And he was like, what? Like, it doesn’t even doesn’t even register. And, like, if somebody calls you stupid and it registers, that means somewhere in your head, you think you’re stupid. So if somebody calls you x, y, or z, and it’s registering and you’re offended by it, that’s because in some level, you believe that. Where if they call you a lamppost or a lampshade or some obscure thing, like, you’re a ceiling fan.
Sean Ginsburg [01:08:34]:
Like, I don’t even
James [01:08:35]:
know what that means. Right?
Sean Ginsburg [01:08:37]:
Right. I love that.
James [01:08:38]:
That’s how you understand where you are on a subconscious level. So it’s interesting where what did you say about victim? Victim is the lowest I forget what you said.
Sean Ginsburg [01:08:48]:
Of consciousness.
James [01:08:49]:
Level of that’s perfect. Perfect. Yeah. I like that. Sean, I think we should end it there. That’s super cool.
Sean Ginsburg [01:08:57]:
Excellent, man.
James [01:08:58]:
Where can people find you?
Sean Ginsburg [01:09:02]:
Go look me up on, social media. @sean.ginsburg sean.ginsburg.
James [01:09:10]:
Alright. Awesome. And do you is there a website at all?
Sean Ginsburg [01:09:15]:
I have a bunch of landing pages. I mean, there’s In Realty.com. There’s, link me on my, Instagram. Just click that. There’s a 1,000 links on there for all types of different stuff.
James [01:09:26]:
Alright. Super cool. And what part of California are you in?
Sean Ginsburg [01:09:30]:
San Diego.
James [01:09:31]:
Oh, beautiful San Diego. I love San Diego. Oh, so you’re safe from fires and all that jazz?
Sean Ginsburg [01:09:38]:
Yes. Thank God. My hearts go out to those people up there, man. That is crazy out there. It’s like an apocalypse Sean. It’s nuts. We got it. It’s really busy down here right now because of the fires actually.
Sean Ginsburg [01:09:47]:
It’s I haven’t seen traffic like this in years. It’s it’s normal.
James [01:09:52]:
People are migrating down.
Sean Ginsburg [01:09:54]:
Big time. Oh, yeah.
James [01:09:56]:
Oh, interesting. Well, I can’t say I blame them. San Diego is pretty kick ass city.
Sean Ginsburg [01:10:01]:
It is beautiful here. I I mean, it’s it’s gorgeous. It’s hard to leave.
James [01:10:05]:
Yeah. I get it. I get it. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Sean.
Sean Ginsburg [01:10:09]:
Likewise, man. Thanks for having me on. I appreciate it.
James [01:10:12]:
You bet. This has been Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle, stories, and triumphant successes of business owners across the land. My name is James Kademan and Authentic Business Adventures is brought to you by Calls On Call, offering call answering and receptionist services for service businesses across the country on the web at callsoncall.com. And of course, The Bold Business Book, a book for the entrepreneur in all of us, available wherever fine books are sold. We’d like to thank you, our wonderful listeners, as well as our guest, Sean In of SG Consulting. Sean, can you tell us that Instagram handle one more time?
Sean Ginsburg [01:10:47]:
@Sean.Ginsburg
James [01:10:53]:
Perfect. Past episodes can be found morning, noon, and night at the podcast link found at drawincustomers.com. Thank you for joining us. We will see you next week. I want you to stay awesome. And if you do nothing else, enjoy your business.